General Discussion Thread

[curiosity]

I've had undiagnosed issues with depression and anxiety since before I could read, so I had no idea it was possible to feel any other way.

Well, it seems like more and more people having these nowadays. Or they've just learned to finally notice it. I know that young people have such issues too, to the older generation's surprise (to quote my mother, "How can you even suppose that you are depressed?! You're too young! You're imagining things").

So yes, I'd say if you (or anyone else) recognize yourself in that description, you should talk to a doctor about it. Especially if it's lasted as long as two years. But first--and this is the advice my friend gave me--write down what you recognize in it. How often do you not feel like eating/doing fun things/socializing/cleaning/taking care of yourself/making phone calls/etc? How often are you tired? How hard is it to finish projects? How hard is it to get up in the morning? Write it down in the plainest, barest language you can, just a list. Make it as accurate to what you're feeling as you can make it. THEN go to the doctor, and ask what they think. Because whatever they say, it is always, always better to know.

Thanks a lot for your advise  I've arrived to a conclusion here. Hope it will be useful not only for me.

[hushpiper]

Aw yeah! You did it! And you can also get through the rest of it.

Now I have to do all the things I'm delaying... *cough*essays*cough*

DO IT! Dooooo eeeeet! Personally, when I was writing essays constantly? My strategy was to sit down, bribe myself with something or other (get this done and then you can watch cat videos! but not until you're done!), sketch out a rough outline of how the essay is supposed to go, and then write the crappiest essay I could manage. Because getting words down is the hard part. Editing afterwards is relatively easy.

Seems that those are linked with introversion.
In example the phonephobia when trying to call, we don't want to disturb people and we require a lot of information about the other guy to make that call, to avound unwanted reactions.

*wags head* It can be linked to personality, to a certain extent. But what you just described to me? Sounds like social anxiety. Which is A) very common, and B) treatable. And treating it doesn't change who you are--I've been on those drugs, I've done the therapy route, I can say this for sure. What it does is make the hard things easier.

Yesssssss. That second Hyperbole and a Half post came out around the time when I was having that crisis, and I read it over and over, because it was scathing and funny and plainly, baldly honest and I needed that at the time.

Well, it seems like more and more people having these nowadays. Or they've just learned to finally notice it. I know that young people have such issues too, to the older generation's surprise (to quote my mother, "How can you even suppose that you are depressed?! You're too young! You're imagining things").

Thanks a lot for your advise  I've arrived to a conclusion here. Hope it will be useful not only for me.

*wry smile* My parents said much the same thing. Which is part of why it took so long for me to actually get help. Ironically they both have problems at least as bad as mine if not worse--problems that have negatively impacted not only them, but their kids. So I really do think it's a matter of people starting to recognize what was already there, rather than more people having mental health issues than they used to. Here's to progress!

[Sunflower]

... it seems like more and more people having these nowadays. Or they've just learned to finally notice it. I know that young people have such issues too, to the older generation's surprise (to quote my mother, "How can you even suppose that you are depressed?! You're too young! You're imagining things").

Not to be hard on your mother, but depression isn't solely the result of external circumstances -- such as the cumulative burden of losses/disappointments over the course of a lifetime, if that's what she's thinking. 

A lot of what's changed over the past 30-40 years is recognizing that at least a part of depression is chemical (although that varies from person to person, of course).  It has to do with a deficiency in brain transmitters, the same way that diabetes or anemia stem from other chemical deficiencies -- and like those disorders, it can be addressed medically.  None of them mean anything's "wrong" with you.  It's just that we're complex creatures, and sometimes our ingredients get out of balance. 

The wild card is that depression affects mood and thinking, so it can actually "beat a path" more heavily in negative parts of your mind that can make you even more depressed because you isolate yourself, have less energy to do stimulating things, etc.  (And that's one reason to get clinical depression checked out sooner rather than later: so your brain doesn't wear a groove into the dark parts.)

Of course, taking a pill by itself isn't the solution.  Just like with diabetes or anemia, lifestyle changes help.  For example, I am a couch potato by nature, but I recognize that exercise really does help lift the mood.  It has to be the right kind of exercise for me, though -- namely, a group exercise class (e.g. I have to show up at a given time/place, and I have peer pressure not to quit midway through) that's not too hard, and has music I like.  For other people, it might be an hour of weight-lifting, blissfully alone. 

Plus, there could be cognitive or behavioral therapy (it doesn't have to be the old Freudian model seen in so many jokes); prayer/meditation; getting draining influences/people out of your life where possible and bringing in things/people that recharge you, even a good meal -- a lot of different factors that vary from person to person. 

But the first step is just to notice what's going on with yourself.  The second step is to consider that things could be different.  If you can picture that, a lot of other things become possible.

[OrigamiOwl]

Some of those, yes. Like avoiding phone calls (boy, I've always hated phone/skype talks for lots of different reasons).
But feeling like a squeezed out lemon after doing things that usually require low effort has nothing to do with introversion, methinks. Same for having no enthusiasm for your favourite tasks or feeling no joy at all. (Yet all these are managable, you can still functionate well enough not to die, so it is okay if it is natural for you, I guess).

Phone calls to strangers feel terrible until I hear it pick up on the other end, then I snap into pro-phone-speaker-joy mode. I quite like talking on the phone, because I can be/pretend to be happy and nice and cheerful like how I'd want to be all the time. And even if being happy is inappropriate for a situation, it's excused because I'm on the phone! ;3

[Oskutin]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Telephone_phobia

The fear of telephones can range from the action or thought of answering and receiving calls to the actual ringing produced by the telephone. The ringing sound can generate a string of anxieties, characterized by thoughts associated with having to speak, perform and converse.[2] Many of those suffering from this phobia may perceive the other end as threatening or intimidating,[5] or may worry about finding an appropriate time to call, in fear of being a nuisance. One other source of anxiety can come from the low quality voice and that people on the receiving end won't understand what the calling end is saying, or vice versa. Another source of anxiety comes from the lack of body language, which no longer becomes available through the telephone and results in the individual losing their sense of control.[5] Past experiences, such as overhearing something traumatic or an unpleasant and angry call, may also play a part in creating fear.[2] Sufferers typically report fear that they would fail to respond appropriately in a telephone conversation,[1] and fear finding nothing to say, which would end in embarrassing silence, stammering, or stuttering.[1] The associated avoidance behavior includes asking others (e.g. relatives at home) to take their phone calls and exclusive use of answering machines.[1]

Another reason is the sufferers may believe that people who call them bear bad or upsetting news, or that the person on the other end may be a prank caller.

[Eich]

Of course, taking a pill by itself isn't the solution.  Just like with diabetes or anemia, lifestyle changes help.  For example, I am a couch potato by nature, but I recognize that exercise really does help lift the mood.  It has to be the right kind of exercise for me, though -- namely, a group exercise class (e.g. I have to show up at a given time/place, and I have peer pressure not to quit midway through) that's not too hard, and has music I like.  For other people, it might be an hour of weight-lifting, blissfully alone. 

Plus, there could be cognitive or behavioral therapy (it doesn't have to be the old Freudian model seen in so many jokes); prayer/meditation; getting draining influences/people out of your life where possible and bringing in things/people that recharge you, even a good meal -- a lot of different factors that vary from person to person. 

But the first step is just to notice what's going on with yourself.  The second step is to consider that things could be different.  If you can picture that, a lot of other things become possible.

Yes!  That's how I worked out in late high school/early college.  All alone, nobody to watch me (even though they probably wouldn't be watching me anyway), nobody to interrupt my thoughts...  Unfortunately, I didn't have anyone there to tell me the correct form or methods, so I ended up doing low weight, high reps, and getting toned instead of building mass.  I really do want to start working out again though, because it feels rewarding, even though it sucks.

I think what got me out of my depressions was learning to rely on other people.  After that I think I felt a lot more comfortable with myself and learned to loosen up. 

Phone calls to strangers feel terrible until I hear it pick up on the other end, then I snap into pro-phone-speaker-joy mode. I quite like talking on the phone, because I can be/pretend to be happy and nice and cheerful like how I'd want to be all the time. And even if being happy is inappropriate for a situation, it's excused because I'm on the phone! ;3

Phone conversations are terrifying.  You are a brave and gifted soul. 

[Piney]

*wags head* It can be linked to personality, to a certain extent. But what you just described to me? Sounds like social anxiety. Which is A) very common, and B) treatable. And treating it doesn't change who you are--I've been on those drugs, I've done the therapy route, I can say this for sure. What it does is make the hard things easier.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Telephone_phobia

I have this "telephone phobia", and I agree that it's social anxiety (EDIT: it actually says it on the Wikipedia page ha). I know plenty of introverts who are perfectly fine with calling people. But me, noooooooo. No no no. I don't so much have social anxiety as I do social phobia (i.e. I don't so much get anxious, just scared and inhibited), but the two seem to be synonymous. I can never call someone unless it's my mom, because I know when she's free. Otherwise, I avoid it at all costs. I'm a little bit better with answering the phone, as long as I know who's calling.

[curiosity]

I have this "telephone phobia", and I agree that it's social anxiety (EDIT: it actually says it on the Wikipedia page ha). I know plenty of introverts who are perfectly fine with calling people. But me, noooooooo. No no no. I don't so much have social anxiety as I do social phobia (i.e. I don't so much get anxious, just scared and inhibited), but the two seem to be synonymous. I can never call someone unless it's my mom, because I know when she's free. Otherwise, I avoid it at all costs. I'm a little bit better with answering the phone, as long as I know who's calling.

You know, when I'm calling/writing someone I don't know well or don't know at all (well, sometimes you just have to do it), I always think that I've chosen the wrong timing and they will get irritated or even mad at me, and making someone irritated or mad is the last thing I would ever want to do. And even distracting them from the things they do feels bad.
Somehow I've got a feeling you have somewhat similar reason. 

[Oskutin]

You know, when I'm calling/writing someone I don't know well or don't know at all (well, sometimes you just have to do it), I always think that I've chosen the wrong timing and they will get irritated or even mad at me, and making someone irritated or mad is the last thing I would ever want to do. And even distracting them from the things they do feels bad.
Somehow I've got a feeling you have somewhat similar reason. 

Same.
There's very few people who i could call without those problems...

[Piney]

You know, when I'm calling/writing someone I don't know well or don't know at all (well, sometimes you just have to do it), I always think that I've chosen the wrong timing and they will get irritated or even mad at me, and making someone irritated or mad is the last thing I would ever want to do. And even distracting them from the things they do feels bad.
Somehow I've got a feeling you have somewhat similar reason. 

Yes yes yes, that is me... that is accurate

[curiosity]

Hey, I've just thought that if some Mr. Psychologist stumbled upon our discossion here, he would be happy to see such a great load of practicing material 

[Oskutin]

Closest would be me, even i'm an engineer 

I'm wondering why people like us are more likely to develope 'telephone phobia'.
Many of seems to think during calling attempt that 'I hope i don't call in a bad time' or else.
We clearly don't want to disrupt others.
And when receiving calls from unknown numbers, we're afraid that it's telemarketer or prank call.

So our brains are wired in a way that we'll need a lot of information before making decision.
That might be more or less incurable, only thing you can relieve the symptons if they're really bad, but calling and receiving calls will always be somewhat hard.

I would say that the society has more or less failed by forcing some weird standards and failing to provide alternatives.

[Lenny]

What got me into a depressive state of mind that lasted most of my teens and part of my childhood was being treated very differently. When I first moved here, I was quite young, so I was able to go to school with other children my age at the same time as they first started going to school - no one thought that a girl who didn't speak English and later spoke it with an accent and a little oddly and never spoke it with her family was weird, because it was a small school and no one to tell them differently. I grew up with an illusion that yes, my family was different, but it didn't matter, and people wouldn't treat me or my family any differently because of it. Unfortunately that illusion was shattered. And even more unfortunately it was shattered by people I had rather grown to trust - not peers, but adults. Cue several years of reclusive behaviour, dropping of friendships and activities because they didn't really matter, onset of severe dislike of this place, keeping even people who did care about me at arms length, and lack of enthusiasm in practically everything except for art and books. I also developed a distrust of people. It also didn't help that I was a very smart child, and that in some respects I was smarter and more mature than quite a few adults - which unfortunately led to a tendency to look down onto others slightly, and a tendency to be very cynical. I never let either of those show if I could help it, but thinking like that doesn't help anyone relationships-wise or health-wise, and it's erroneous to boot.

Anyway. Due to distrust on one side, and a desire not to worry those closest to me on the other (and hence never voicing complaints that could have perhaps alerted them), it was quite hard for me to get out of that. I don't think it was ever as bad as described here or in the comic, but it was ... a period of time in which I couldn't enjoy anything except escapism, and there were times where even that didn't work and I was in complete apathetic slumps. I only got out of it due to a very determined friend, haha. He showed me that really, truly, not all people are two-faced and shallow and weak. I don't think I'd ever had a friend like him before, except for in primary school - one that would bug me and bug me until I'd talk about something or do something or see something. It's a bit cheesy saying it ... he was colour-blind, but gave me the ability to see colour in my world again. I didn't even realise there was something wrong with me until I experienced living without it. It was ... well, it made me determine that I never ever want to go back to those times or mindset ever again. Never. It's hard sometimes, but I'm trying now, and trying when knowing what's wrong is so much different than trying without knowing anything except that something is wrong somewhere.

So yeah. I'm glad you've got the courage to do something about it, hushpiper. I wish you, and everyone else here who needs it, lots of strength~

Phone conversations are terrifying.  You are a brave and gifted soul. 

I'm not so bad as to be afraid of telephone calls, but I do dislike them rather. I avoid using them unless totally necessary. Mainly because the voices are so weird, and because I was traumatized once by my high school principal (whom I shared a mutual dislike with and who had somehow by some means that I STILL haven't discovered found my mobile number) ringing me up when I least expected it. And I never know what to say. I don't really care about inconveniencing people, but having to say things... bleh. I muddle them usually, and that irritates me. So, I dislike telephones...

Hey, I've just thought that if some Mr. Psychologist stumbled upon our discossion here, he would be happy to see such a great load of practicing material 

Haha, probably! XD Haha, it's given me some pretty silly images in my head, that.

[curiosity]

I would say that the society has more or less failed by forcing some weird standards and failing to provide alternatives.

But why, telephones are an alternative to meeting in person. And I guess text messages are an alternative to both phone talks and physical meeting.

But I'd rather do something of mentioned above - either texting, or meeting up. The latter can make me really nervous sometimes (to the verge of feeling physically sick), but it is still easier than phone talks. There is a reason: while talking on the phone, I can only focus on what is the person saying, which renders me pretty bound and not able to do something useful at the same time. And some people can talk for hours. Sitting all this time, listening, answering and not doing anything any other tasks at all is terrible. The major waste of time.

Also, I have a silent voice and I loathe shouting, and the connection or the other's person telephone can be bad sometimes, so you have to speak louder to be heard. And ask two or more times when you've failed to hear something. Bleh.

[StellersJayC]

Same.
There's very few people who i could call without those problems...

I just... Don't like calling people. It's not that I'm scared, it doesn't even make me feel strange. I can't understand it. Talking in person is - usually - okay, and any form of written communication is just fine.