This kind of budded off the analysis of the Known World's economy:
tristen --> TSCTH...I was hoping a different means of post-scarcity tech (my purest form of non-capitalism behaviour, etc.) would make itself known in the future (e.g. unlimited personal fusion power to run our own hand-held replicators
TSCTH --> tristen ...You raised a very interesting point (the belief that all economical systems are either capitalist by modern standards or "primitive"-ish), so i ran with it. ^_^
And as for post-scarcity, it's not really gonna happen, since post-scarcity would ultimately require the non-existence of humans. And once humans are gone, scarcity and non-scarcity in terms of humanity's resources becomes a moot point.
We will likely reach a point were we can drop both a monetary type economy (what we have now) and a material type economy (what we once had), by using automation, robotics and fAI/gAI to make everything needed for survival free.
But in all likelihood we'd still have some kinda economy running, as they'd still be many people with many different needed not based in survival. So experiences (books, movies, theater, vacations, human interaction, games, etc), novelty (one-off art, improvised music, etc) and many other things could very well form the basis of this economy.
tristen --> TSCTH
Perhaps. But as soon as we reasonably sever the demand/supply relationship (lose care in waste? excess?) and create a certain quantity and complexity of experiences that no human could ever hope to completely devour in a lifetime, witness a MMPORG with places and activities so individual and all-consuming, that we have effectively hit post-scarcity.
Doesn't an economy pre-suppose trade or desiring to have something someone else has so that they can no longer have it? But if you create your own thing, custom, every time - never desiring anything else anyone has except as a point of reference to influence your own wants, is that not effectively post-scarcity? An infinite tree of branches. Do we need to be plugged into a Matrix-type enviro, where 90% of our wants are digital, to achieve this post-scarcity? Is that bad? Does that dehumanize us? I'm not convinced.
Effective post-scarcity is likely very close - though it may mean the end of tactile inter-relationships most of the time. It means we'll also likely need to be mining the asteroids and building a Dyson sphere...
TSCTH --> tristen Post-scarcity would require fulfilling every need or want, which creates a huge problem for production. For example, if someone desires something that goes against the laws of physics, then that cannot be fulfilled and therefor creates scarcity.
And an economy does not pre-suppose trade or taking other people's stuff (taking someone else's stuff, so that they can no longer have it, is just plain old greed).
An economy is any system of production, distribution/trade and consumption of limited goods/services. But, it can also be described as any system fixing the problems arising from a group shifting from extreme egalitarian self-reliance (producing most of what you use and getting the rest for free), to systematic labor distribution and tribal politics.
Oh, and i never said post-scarcity would dehumanize us nor that it would require living in a digital world.
I actually think eliminating our current system and replacing it with one not based on money/materials, is vital to the survival of them human species.
tristen Actually, that's one of my favourite SF tropes (?) is for a society to find some future tech (or past future tech) as it were, that enables some great benefit not currently available...
Sir. Orc --> tristenThese people don't have cars. I'm reasonably sure that personal fusion power isn't in the picture, or purely theoretical economic models.
tristen --> Sir. OrcNot that we know about. Secret DARPA plan that was hidden away next to that infamous scandinavian seed vault? Untold energy and biological treasures? Who knows? This story may not limit itself to a simple stumbling through ancient-modern-day-ruins (?) of northern Europe to simply battle trolls but also uncover other technologies, atrocities, or conspiracies… what was that old SF catch-phrase "the truth is out there…"
[Editor's Note: Mulder's credo from "The X-Files."]Sir. Orc Your society would have to be populated by people who are effectively gods in order to achieve post scarcity, as even being able to transmute stuff out of thin air still requires matter and energy to drive it.
Sir. Orc --> tristen What you're probably thinking of is better described as either-post singularity, or post-digital. It's just another technological shift, but resources are still being distributed and allocated, and they are still finite, even if the average consumer doesn't know better. On the macro level, something still has to be driving everything.