Author Topic: Bad Space comics (spoilers)  (Read 5160 times)

Linebyline

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Re: Bad Space comics (spoilers)
« Reply #15 on: March 15, 2023, 05:47:48 PM »
I actually saw Suit once before, somewhere. I think somebody posted it to Tumblr or Imgur. It's definitely a horror story.

As for the rest... You guys, I think this might not be the comic for me. I haven't read all of them, but from what I have read, either they're horror (which is fine, just not my cup of tea) or their weirdly nihilistic if not outright misanthropic. Take The Neanderthal's Secret (might be misremembering that title slightly). It's pretty heavy-handed about humanity in geeral being the bad guy. Even where that's not the case, it's still full of people living meaningless lives and dying meaningless deaths. And I don't know, I get enough of that in real life (c.f. the one about the cosmonaut). After about five or six of these, I think I'm going to take a pass on reading the rest.

I will say, though, that the artwork is consistently high-quality. I may not care for the subject matter, but I have to admire the craftsmanship.
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Jitter

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Re: Bad Space comics (spoilers)
« Reply #16 on: March 15, 2023, 06:32:13 PM »
It’s exactly like you say it, LineByLine. It seems to me the works are the author’s outlet for letting the desperation out, the desperation he feels exactly because of the nihilism and bleakness all around. I feel the same sometimes, luckily not all the time :) I fully support your decision to skip this one, when it makes you feel worse then the wise thing is to stop!
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thegreyarea

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Re: Bad Space comics (spoilers)
« Reply #17 on: March 16, 2023, 02:49:42 PM »
Just like Jitter, I see your point, Linebyline. And passing on something you don't enjoy is completely understandable. There is so much to see, and so little time...
BTW I also saw "The Suit" before. I just don't recall where.

Well, today I read "After Life". Below are some thoughts

Spoiler: show
So this explores the possibility that some over dimensional "benefactors" could find our struggles to survive interesting enough to "collect" our minds for scientific purposes when we die.
And after those studies they kindly give us whatever paradise we wanted during our life. Forever...

It's implied that those mysterious entities do all that without asking our consent, and later without informing us of the fact that our afterlife is essentially a simulation.
And if we choose to self-terminate they simply reboot the simulation, again and again.

A bit like in "The Suit", a technologically enabled being engages in actions that affect us, and that happens beyond our control. But here there's no cautionary tale. It's not our tech.
However, just like the suit, those beings don't seem to care much if we suffer in the process. Their ends justify their means.

The "Masters" on After Life treat us like we do with guinea pigs in our labs.

We don't do our experiments to make them suffer, even being aware they endure some suffering. We even try to minimize it.
Perhaps that's one moral question the author considers relevant: "Put yourself in the place of a lab rat. How do you feel?"

I tend to agree, with the difference that, to our knowledge, lab rats are not sentient (in the sense of "I think, therefore I exist").

That leads to another frequent questions in Science Fiction: Are we sentient, in the view of some extremely advanced being? Or are we placed in the "smart animal" category? Some of the best SF stories are those able to push us outside our anthropocentric point of view. Which in turn opens space for some self-reflection :)

Another question: Why can't these all powerful entities make our simulated afterlives more interesting?
In the story it's because they use our own brain as sole source of information for our simulation.
But why would they have such limitation?
They have access to an unlimited number of brains (or souls, if you want to call it that way), and even if they don't the simulation software should be able to create new situations and new "Non-Playable Characters" easily. Damn, we can already do that on our games.

Also, why they reboot our afterlives? If we chose to terminate, why restart?
Their computational resources are unlimited? Even if they are, what would be their motivation?

Is the author trying to ask: "What would you think if you know for sure there's an actual afterlife, but it's not provided by a benevolent God, but rather a simulation ran by ultra advanced beings from another dimension?"

Or yet "If we call these being(s) God(s), if they collect our "souls" when we die and, after a brief(?) analysis, offer us the after life we always wanted, is there really a difference?"

BTW, again Iain M Banks' Culture fans will find similarities with topics that exist in the books, like the "snapshot", that's akin to a copy of someone's "mind state" in the Culture, the existence of "simulated afterlives", that is particularly relevant on "Surface Detail", and the existence of super dimensional beings.
And the reference to "Seven Higher Dimensions", that together with our usual four makes eleven dimensions, matches exactly the number of dimensions mentioned by Banks...

All that said, it's an interesting story, much less frightening than "The Suit" (unless you consider frightening dying of boredom after living thousands of years in paradise) and the art is beautiful, as usual.


Now I'm curious to see the next one...
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thegreyarea

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Re: Bad Space comics (spoilers)
« Reply #18 on: March 20, 2023, 03:38:11 PM »
Well, continuing with Bad Space Comics, it's time for "The Great Minds".

IMO this one has the peculiar characteristic of being (mostly) the continuation of the previous one, "After Life".

Thoughts, and Spoilers:
Spoiler: show
The great minds explains how these ultra advanced beings from a dying Universe, that is not ours, devised a strategy to gain a foothold on this younger Universe, supposedly to create the conditions for their migration to new, greener pastures...

And what, or better said who is the foothold? Humans tiny minds, that they have been molding and testing for a long time (their percepton of time is clearly different from ours). That comes to me as the revelation of why, on the previous story, there was such an interest on evaluating human minds.
And it also explains the reason for all the effort they put into caring for those minds, giving them simulated paradises (let's consider that they believe to be doing a good thing): They feel responsible for us because they, in a way, created us. (Hence the "Old Gods" in the end).

Again we don't have a very uncomfortable outcome, unless it happens for our generation to be the one the "Great Minds" decide to inhabit. Considering what we know about humankind current state I'd say there's not much to fear now or in the upcoming centuries... :)

The questions here are to a large extente the ones raised on "After Life", with the added weight of knowing our minds are, for the Great Minds / Old Gods, simply the byproduct of a process, and when this process is ready we will be discarded to leave space for them to "possess" us. Again not that frightening. We would either be erased (hopefully in a painless way) or removed to our paradise of choice.

Of course this could take a dark turn if we start questioning if all those stories about "possessions" by spirits are actually moments when some random "Great Mind" decides to take a "test drive" to see how well they can handle the current "Beta version"...  O_o

Also that image with the possessed bodies in the end with the ruins in the background reminded me of Arthur C Clarke's "Childhood's End", even if the underlying concept is different.

In terms of art the story is very well done, as usual, and unsurprisingly shows great resemblance with "After Life".


I get the feeling that the next story, Russian Moon, will be quite different...

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Jitter

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Re: Bad Space comics (spoilers)
« Reply #19 on: March 20, 2023, 05:51:19 PM »
The Great Minds

Spoiler: show
I think the author actually confirms as a response to a reader question that this is indeed part 2 for After Life.

However, note it’s not necessarily implied that the Great Minds intended to overtake an existing creature’s mind. Another interpretation could be that they will use our minds as templates only, and create new ones for themselves when they transfer here. This would be a more polite entry.
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thegreyarea

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Re: Bad Space comics (spoilers)
« Reply #20 on: March 22, 2023, 04:51:00 PM »
The Great Minds

Spoiler: show
I think the author actually confirms as a response to a reader question that this is indeed part 2 for After Life.

However, note it’s not necessarily implied that the Great Minds intended to overtake an existing creature’s mind. Another interpretation could be that they will use our minds as templates only, and create new ones for themselves when they transfer here. This would be a more polite entry.

Yes, that polite way is possible, and would provide a cleanner start, I suppose. :)

Well, today I read "Russian Moon" and here are my thoughts:

Spoiler: show
Russian Moon has no horror, no gross-out. It only implies that the fate of those cosmonauts is sealed (due to several technical problems) and, worse, their sacrifice, loss, and triumphs, would never be known, because their country would never admit an unsuccessful outcome.

That particular cosmonaut, however, doesn't seem troubled by her fate. I read it as if she's so fascinated by having "accomplished the mission" and to actually set foot on the moon that her imminent death is not, at least momentarily, a relevant issue. Knowing that she was the first was enough.

That makes me recall the (brilliant) speech Nixon had prepared for the eventual failure of the first Apollo landing.



Fate has ordained that the men who went to the moon to explore in peace will stay on the moon to rest in peace.

These brave men, Neil Armstrong and Edwin Aldrin, know that there is no hope for their recovery. But they also know that there is hope for mankind in their sacrifice.

These two men are laying down their lives in mankind’s most noble goal: the search for truth and understanding.

They will be mourned by their families and friends; they will be mourned by their nation; they will be mourned by the people of the world; they will be mourned by a Mother Earth that dared send two of her sons into the unknown.

In their exploration, they stirred the people of the world to feel as one; in their sacrifice, they bind more tightly the brotherhood of man.

In ancient days, men looked at stars and saw their heroes in the constellations. In modern times, we do much the same, but our heroes are epic men of flesh and blood.

Others will follow, and surely find their way home. Man’s search will not be denied. But these men were the first, and they will remain the foremost in our hearts.

For every human being who looks up at the moon in the nights to come will know that there is some corner of another world that is forever mankind.




Now, would that Russian cover-up be possible? I'm not a great believer in conspiracy theories. Sending people to the moon was (and is) a very demanding project that would involve many people across the country. I consider possible, but unlikely they could keep it secret for a long time.

Anyway nice story. And IIRC the drawings are not only beautiful but also reflect the real soviet designs for a moon landing mission. (I'm too lazy now to go search for a link...)
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JoB

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Re: Bad Space comics (spoilers)
« Reply #21 on: March 23, 2023, 05:46:24 AM »
Now, would that Russian cover-up be possible?
The USSR was able to cover up quite important disasters on the ground back in its days, but:

One of the counterpoints to the "the USA never landed on the moon" conspiracy theories is that radio amateurs worldwide could, and did, pick up the spacecraft's radio transmissions, and verified that they indeed came from space, rather than being broadcast from terrestrial stations. In the same logic, for a Soviet spacecraft to go to the moon unnoticed, it would have had to maintain nigh-complete radio silence ... and the technology back then was nowhere near producing self-sufficient spacecraft, in terms of computing power to keep the systems under control.
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thegreyarea

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Re: Bad Space comics (spoilers)
« Reply #22 on: March 23, 2023, 12:22:12 PM »
The USSR was able to cover up quite important disasters on the ground back in its days, but:

One of the counterpoints to the "the USA never landed on the moon" conspiracy theories is that radio amateurs worldwide could, and did, pick up the spacecraft's radio transmissions, and verified that they indeed came from space, rather than being broadcast from terrestrial stations. In the same logic, for a Soviet spacecraft to go to the moon unnoticed, it would have had to maintain nigh-complete radio silence ... and the technology back then was nowhere near producing self-sufficient spacecraft, in terms of computing power to keep the systems under control.
Yes, they were able... for some time. But sooner or later most things surfaced. And the bigger they are the harder it gets.
Sending a manned ship to the moon took the USA a lot of effort. Many thousands of scientists, contractors, etc... were involved. Wikipedia states that "At its peak, it employed over 400,000 employees and contractors around the country". They had to develop a huge rocket, the ship, the landing module, the instalations and labs and factories for all that... It's hard to believe any nation would be able to keep so many people silent about such a large thing.

(That's, by the way, one point that many conspiracy theories fail to address. As a friend of mine once said: "Just try to have ten people agree on a subject, and to keep silent about it, and you will understand..." :) )

In the American moon landing case, another great proof that it did happen is that the USSR, that was watching closely, would never, ever shut up if it didn't...
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Jitter

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Re: Bad Space comics (spoilers)
« Reply #23 on: March 23, 2023, 01:49:49 PM »
Just one thing to add here: see For All Mankind (Apple TV+, available to buy or rent on Google Play and Amazon.
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thegreyarea

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Re: Bad Space comics (spoilers)
« Reply #24 on: March 23, 2023, 03:57:58 PM »
Thanks for the tip, Jitter! I've already heard good things about that show. I'll try to see it. :)

Just read "Don't look back / The Flood"

Thoughts and spoilers:
Spoiler: show
This one is not in space :)

It's main message is that we, or most likely the coming generations, will pay a high price for our lack of action to stop climate change.

 And the knowledge of that danger makes us hypocrites when we say that we love our children and would do anything for them. And that's the most uncomfortable par of this story. Much more than the drowning of the protagonist.

Sadly there's some truth in that. Societies and individuals are trying to find a balance, reducing negative impacts on the environment while keeping, as much as possible, business as usual. Humankind still don't see the danger as high enough to justify more extreme changes. :(

Will this strategy of slow, almost painless changes be enough to prevent the worst? Those future generations will find out. And what the comic shows, in a quite effective way, is what one of these persons will think if in the end it's not enough.

I suppose the author is doing that as a contribution to avoid that. Many times apocalyptic fiction (nuclear war, man-made pandemics, nanotech going awry, AI uprising, etc...) is used as a cautionary tale of future events we don't want to happen.

All that said I'm not sure he chose the best situation. This kind of massive wave entering the city is usually related with tsunamis, that are driven by forces beyond human influence, so it's hard to connect it with climate change.
It's not even the result of a violent storm, that could be associated with global warming (because its stated that the sky is clear).
The only hypothesis that comes to mind would be the sudden rupture of a dam (defectively) done. A dam that would exist to prevent the rising ocean to flood the city. It's too indirect, and  wouldn't be my choice. I would go for a very long drought and/or a big fire.

Anyway it's well done and carries a relevant message. :) Let's see the next one.
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JoB

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Re: Bad Space comics (spoilers)
« Reply #25 on: March 24, 2023, 03:47:22 AM »
tsunamis, that are driven by forces beyond human influence
... usually ... :3
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Re: Bad Space comics (spoilers)
« Reply #26 on: March 24, 2023, 07:29:33 AM »
... usually ... :3
Well, that was a pretty big "oops!"...

BTW...
Spoiler: show
There's also this kind of tsunami, but I believe if it worked the effects would be at a very local scale. Earthquakes cause tsunamis because they displace large ammounts of land, that in turn displace the water. An atomic blast would vaporize much of the water, and a lot of energy would be absorbed. Using the same weapon above ground would be much more effective. As a physicist said: It "would be a stupid waste of a perfectly good nuclear weapon." So it's more a thing to scare people, or to prove some tech prowees, than a useful weapon.


Still about "Don't Look Back"
Spoiler: show
I feel the "Behind you, silence" as a mistake. How could it be silent? There would be people screaming, things being smashed and broken, the roar of the wave... Not that it spoils the story, but still...


I read "Behind your eyes". Here are some (brief, I promise) thoughts:
Spoiler: show
Another one that's not in space! :)

Interesting concept. What if our conscious mind is just something secondary, a useful tool to the true owner that resides deep into our brain?. A mere puppet?

It may sound disturbing, but that would only mean that our subconscious minds are out of reach. It's still us, just working in mysterious ways, and not bothering to inform the conscious part. It would mean that we don't fully know ourselves, which is probably true to everybody to some degree.

(And that dissociation between conscious and unconscious minds of course may be very serious in psycological diseases, like when killers blame the voices inside their heads.)

The anatomy-style drawings are intended to be disturbing? Didn't had that effect on me, but then I already saw too many of those... And the bugs... I guess the author is not really comfortable with them... :)

All that said, good, but not my preferred piece. Next!




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Re: Bad Space comics (spoilers)
« Reply #27 on: March 24, 2023, 11:54:18 AM »
Well, that was a pretty big "oops!"...

I read "Behind your eyes". Here are some (brief, I promise) thoughts:


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Re: Bad Space comics (spoilers)
« Reply #28 on: March 24, 2023, 01:19:22 PM »
Behind Your Eyes isn’t among my favorites either. It sort of looks like he had an idea that in itself is already horror, but then the art tries (too much, in my opinion) to add horrible elements on top of it, and it ends up going over the top. There’s a saying in Swedish, ”tårta på tårta”, literally ”cake on cake” meaning that trying to add more of the same doesn’t make the thing better. So Beyond Your Eyes is tårta på tårta on horror.

As foe Don’t Look Back, it’s thought provoking! In the words of Meat Loaf, I would do annnnnything for love but I won’t do that. Let’s hope we are not those parents.
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Re: Bad Space comics (spoilers)
« Reply #29 on: March 25, 2023, 06:24:46 PM »
That's it, dmeck. many people feels uncomfortable with insects. I strongly suspect the author of Bad Space feels that way too. Myself... I don't love them, but they don't freak me out either.

Jitter, cake on cake is funny. And it fits well in Behind Your Eyes.
In Brazil the equivalent is "chover no molhado", which means "rain over wet" or "rain over soaked" and is used in the same sense of uselessly adding more of something where it already exists.

So today I read "Empires". I liked it! :) Here are some thoughts:

Spoiler: show
This one has space! :D

And it's quite uplifting... until the last part, where we are reminded that's not us, but rather a parallel Universe.

Since we are on popular sayings, the Portuguese/Brazilian one for this is "apanhar com um balde de água fria", which means "(to be) hit with a bucket of cold water"...

Also no horror, no gross-out, no monsters, which feels a bit... off. The Minotaur only show up as an image, could very well be a statue, and the Labyrinth is just a metaphor to... the perilous path that a civilization has to work out to reach a bright Future?

The idea that if a vulcanic eruption hasn't happened Crete would keep growing and mix with Greece, and therefore Rome would never rise is very interesting. If that would means no Christianity and nos Dark Ages is a larger jump. But that's the way it happened on that Universe, so let's roll with it.

The overall message is "if the civilizations from the past valued women as equals we would be in a much better place today". It's very hard to disagree with that, although I'm not so sure that it would necessarily means a History with so much less slavery and so much more democracy. There are so many factors to consider that it all becomes quite speculative.

Anyway I'm sure we would have a better World if there was more gender equality. :)

The drawings are very beautiful, as usual. And I felt very tempted to write a continuation where the people of that brighter Universe finds a way to cross to ours... I'll think about it.


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