Bugs and things to fix

[Varjohaltia]

We're losing some images -- could it be a hosting problem?  You can see it on the list of emoticons above and the nation/language flags, in particular. 
I just noticed this about 15 minutes ago, i.e. 6:40 p.m. PST on Thursday.

That was my post :-) Maybe I should quit posting, if I keep breaking things (even unintentionally)!

Anyhow, I saw the same, and the site randomly would refuse to serve me pages on several threads when trying to move forward a page. Currently both issues seem to be better, though?

[Sunflower]

That was my post :-) Maybe I should quit posting, if I keep breaking things (even unintentionally)!

Anyhow, I saw the same, and the site randomly would refuse to serve me pages on several threads when trying to move forward a page. Currently both issues seem to be better, though?

Yep, they seem fine now.  I don't know enough about hosting to determine whether it's the kind of thing that just clears up on its own.

[Solokov]

Running into a 403 and 404 error over in the general discussion thread.

403 Forbidden

You don't have permission to access /index.php on this server.
Additionally, a 404 Not Found error was encountered while trying to use an ErrorDocument to handle the request.

The post has two quotes in it and generally I was talking about the ice on the lake nearby and the wreck that went into it and how I hope origamiowl got the good pain meds and that it didn't end up like my experience where the meds I got does nothing for me in regards to pain.

The page comes up when I try to preview or post the post.



Edit: I think I may have figured it out. Apparently the full name of the pain meds I got when my wisdom teeth got pulled was what was kicking me me over onto the 403 page...

[Sunflower]

Running into a 403 and 404 error over in the general discussion thread.

...I was talking about the ice on the lake nearby and the wreck that went into it and how I hope origamiowl got the good pain meds and that it didn't end up like my experience where the meds I got does nothing for me in regards to pain.

Edit: I think I may have figured it out. Apparently the full name of the pain meds I got when my wisdom teeth got pulled was what was kicking me me over onto the 403 page...

EDIT:

Aha!  Now that I've seen your redacted post, I'm almost certain the pharmaceutical name was the trigger.  We have previously noticed this problem with other prescription drug terms -- pen-icillin, Vi=agra, and so forth.  Eich & Co. think it's probably due to an overactive spam filter, most likely on our host site (i.e. not an SMF software problem).

I'm going to try an experiment here:  O*ycontin.  Oxyc-ontin.

In any event, if this pharma-name thing turns out to be a persistent problem, we may need to put up a warning to avoid using those terms -- as a workaround until or unless we can fix the bug.

[Solokov]

EDIT:

Aha!  Now that I've seen your redacted post, I'm almost certain the pharmaceutical name was the trigger.  We have previously noticed this problem with other prescription drug terms -- pen-icillin, Vi=agra, and so forth.  Eich & Co. think it's probably due to an overactive spam filter, most likely on our host site (i.e. not an SMF software problem).

You'd think a spam filter would just kick you back to the reply screen with a big red message that reads "your post contains word(s) that are against the terms of use"... but no it has to be cryptic about it with a 403 page with a 404 error attached to it. That's the worst kind of page because it's one that simply doesn't give a person any idea what just happened.

[Sunflower]

You'd think a spam filter would just kick you back to the reply screen with a big red message that reads "your post contains word(s) that are against the terms of use"... but no it has to be cryptic about it with a 403 page with a 404 error attached to it. That's the worst kind of page because it's one that simply doesn't give a person any idea what just happened.

I share your frustration.  It's definitely a bug, not a feature.  Even our built-in profanity filter doesn't make a fuss, just quietly replaces the naughty word -- say, "s***" -- with asterisks. 

Eich and his brain trust have been trying to crack the code for a while, with no luck.  Meanwhile, all we can do is warn people about avoiding even non-copyrighted names of first-generation antibiotics that spammers don't even try to sell!  (e.g. pen!cillin)  Let alone any more profitable pharmaceuticals. 


On top of that, I think we're still having problems with posts that have too many or the wrong kind of links.  (Sigh.)  Poor Eich is going to face a long "honey-do" list when he gets back on Monday!

[Richard Weir]

We assume that the spam filter is part of the host server's software. It's probable that it operates by inspecting all packets that are sent to the server, regardless of type, and blocks ANY packets that look like spam. It would be too complex for it to be programmed to understand what the packets contain, so all it can do is send back a generic transfer protocol error code that your browser reports. The server software never sees the dropped packet, so it can't deal with the event in any way at all!

[Sunflower]

We assume that the spam filter is part of the host server's software.

It's probable that it operates by inspecting all packets that are sent to the server, regardless of type, and blocks ANY packets that look like spam. It would be too complex for it to be programmed to understand what the packets contain, so all it can do is send back a generic transfer protocol error code that your browser reports.

The server software never sees the dropped packet, so it can't deal with the event in any way at all!

Interesting theory, Richard. 

In that case, would it be futile to set up a manual spam filter for the pharma/spam terms, which could either asterisk them out as with swearwords, or at least return an error message to the writer, as Solokov suggested?

[Richard Weir]

Yes, that would be the case.

However, there is a big gap between theory and actuality and that one may well be wrong. Maybe, if Eich and co work at it long enough, they will discover that the forum software is attempting to access a misplaced resource in the wrong directory, and that is causing the error. Or something!

[JoB]

Maybe, if Eich and co work at it long enough, they will discover that the forum software is attempting to access a misplaced resource in the wrong directory, and that is causing the error.

That's why, as part of my experimentation, I threw "naughty words" at the server in such a way that the request wouldn't go to the forum s/w in the first place. They still triggered the error, so that very likely happens before SMF ever receives the data.

[Sunflower]

That's why, as part of my experimentation, I threw "naughty words" at the server in such a way that the request wouldn't go to the forum s/w in the first place. They still triggered the error, so that very likely happens before SMF ever receives the data.

So IIUC, our *host*'s sensitivity to pharma/spam terms is what's causing the 403 problem.  Nothing to do with SMF.  Yes?

Would it make sense to issue a general warning (either in the "News" slot at the top of the page, or via sticky at the top of this board) to all posters, to avoid the 403 problem by not using the proper name of any prescription meds?  (And any other known trigger terms.*)

I realize that would only be a workaround till we actually find a fix.  But at least it would spare posters some time and effort.  (Or would explain to frustrated posters why the forum ate their work!)

Just a suggestion.  We'd probably want Eich and hushpiper to weigh in first, plus anyone else who's interested.

P.S.  Hmmmm.  The host won't let me say "Russ!an br!des" either.  The 404 errors stopped the instant I took out the original term.

[FinnishViking]

Might be an idea to make a wholly new section of the forums just for the news so they would easy to find and people would be more inclined to notice them since some may not be intrested on venturing to this part for that.

This also provides you guys a good platform to give news about new changes like promotions to mod and things like that, maybe a tread to name the new people that joined during the week?

[JoB]

So IIUC, our *host*'s sensitivity to pharma/spam terms is what's causing the 403 problem.  Nothing to do with SMF.  Yes?

That's what I'ld conclude from the experiment's result, yes. Though I have to brandish Occam's Razor a bit to get there.

Would it make sense to issue a general warning (either in the "News" slot at the top of the page, or via sticky at the top of this board) to all posters, to avoid the 403 problem by not using the proper name of any prescription meds?  (And any other known trigger terms.*)

Considering where new forum users come from, and how likely they are to start posting about their health issues before even having caught up with currently active threads , I'ld say it'ld be a tad more sensible than the current link back to the actual comic.

[Sunflower]

Considering where new forum users come from, and how likely they are to start posting about their health issues before even having caught up with currently active threads , I'ld say it'd be a tad more sensible than the current link back to the actual comic.

Why, JoB, are you casting aspersions on the nice people who read the Guardian?   

(Actually, I can imagine that even the Guardian -- which I gather is relatively highbrow among British daily papers, at least compared to the Sun and Daily Mail -- gets a lot of horrid trolling on its online comment pages, as Hrolfr testified.  The Washington Post, which I read online, also attracts a relatively educated, affluent audience... and its comment pages are nonetheless full of horrid, lowbrow insults and nutty stuff.)

[JoB]

Why, JoB, are you casting aspersions on the nice people who read the Guardian?   

No, I'm saying that new users of the forum are likely to have been pointed to it on Minna's site, and unlikely to have much use for the link pointing back to it on the forum's top right very often.