Since I have no artistic ability, I decided to try AI art. The prompt I used was "bald man with big white beard with round eyes and seagull standing on his head" -- Väinö Väänänen, in other words.
The results are ... unusual. See here. (https://creator.nightcafe.studio/creation/96LFi8hY5EHiJUoKqMqw) There are four images, one showing the hazards of having a seagull standing on your head.
Lwise,
He is beautiful. Just need the sparkles around his hair ;)
I do not believe in Talent it is just a question of practice.
...I have to argue with that assumption! Despite having had many lessons and practised hard throughout my life, I have no artistic ability whatever, I can barely draw a stick figure. I inherited the family music and wordskill no problems, and those do improve with use, and strangely I can carve, sculpt, embroider, work metal and such with no problems, but painting and drawing utterly elude me. No idea why! Hence the blanket assumption of ‘it just takes practice’ annoys me.
(https://i.postimg.cc/zvD6R9Gv/E9-CCF0-AE-89-D6-459-C-952-C-3-BD9076-AE139.jpg)
Here’s the other Lalli
I like this one better! The makeup is less prominent because of the unconventional expression.
And I guessed of course that the makeup is due to the AI source material making it “think” “wimmin always want to and must be as pretty as possible”. Kind of makes me sad to think that it’s nearly impossible to get rid of makeup even when trying!
(I’m not on Discord, yet, I tried once but got very confused, I should ask my teenage son to show me the ropes)
AIs have extreme trouble with hands and paws. Also ears.
Most artists I know will tell you AIs aren't the only ones that have trouble with hands and ears! :haw:yes
This one came out quite nicely on the second try. Although sideburns without beard on the chin is apparently unheard of (or alternatively has a name I don’t know).Sideburns without a beard are called muttonchops
Lwise, I see you posted lots of portraits on AO3! Link thme here too, please?
Ho ho ho! Merry Christmas, squishy human-things! You look delicious!
(https://i.postimg.cc/65hCWnVf/607-A7-F58-F471-41-FF-941-C-2-EF487510-AE5.jpg)
Lwise, I see you posted lots of portraits on AO3! Link thme here too, please?
Ho ho ho! Merry Christmas, squishy human-things! You look delicious!
(https://i.postimg.cc/65hCWnVf/607-A7-F58-F471-41-FF-941-C-2-EF487510-AE5.jpg)
The more I work on the characters and admire yours, the more it bugs me that there’s no way to lock a look. Like say ok this is my Trond, now show this person in a scene from a spy movie, and it would retain the likeness. I mean such tools have to exist because there’s talk about using AI for movies etc, and the DeepFake “photos” and such require this, but it’s not available on NightCafe.
I can easily see why professional artists are worried. However, we still have painters despite the fact that we also have photographs. An AI doesn’t have imagination or creativity. Maybe one day it will, but that time is still far off. And if and when it happens, will the entity still be a machine? Or would a creative AI be considered an artificial person?
Anne is perfect!
"Plutonium is a dense, heavy metal with a high atomic mass, whereas feathers are much lighter and less dense, with a lower atomic mass. As a result, 53 kilos of feathers, which is equal to 53,000 grams, would weigh significantly more than 53,000 grams of plutonium."... you know, I'd find this counterpoint more convincing if it didn't immediately remind me of the ca. 2000 years it took us humans to rid ourselves (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Delft_tower_experiment) of a certain other misconception in that field ...
I'm not sure what the man is sitting on.Seeing that he's apparently larger than a horse, whatever he wants to.
Since we're showing off failures, I thought you might like this one:Ohai Poochriel (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Puriel) ...
(https://i.postimg.cc/KzgWzHSr/angel-walking-beside-dog.png)
The prompt was "heavenly angel, julie bell, bouguereau , walking beside golden retriever, art composition".
Lwise, the retriever-angel (or angel-retriever) is hilarious!! I believe you've inadvertently created the spirit animal of someone out there!
And clearly the old gentleman in the top hat is the horse's partner in pulling the carriage. They're just taking a break...
I have spent 20 NightCafe credits today trying to get an image of an aircraft carrier turned into a village and it’s useless! It’s either aircraft carrier AND a city, or just a jumble of parts. Irritating.The problem is that IRL an aircraft carrier already IS a city (look up how many people it takes to run one).
I have spent 20 NightCafe credits today trying to get an image of an aircraft carrier turned into a village and it’s useless! It’s either aircraft carrier AND a city, or just a jumble of parts. Irritating.
Brilliant! All of these are so good! And Gøran’s beard IS awesome!
You’re right, Buteo, she does look a bit like me, in attitude and carriage, though my hair is wavy rather than curly and my glasses are more rectangular. There are a few photos of me on the Reenactment thread, early on, doing my mediæval fair thing and handling a barn owl, so you can compare. But the general air of ‘cheerful competent old country lady’ is certainly similar.
I was trying to match this image of BeritConsidering what we've seen of AI art, it's probably quite good that you left Bipolar Cat out of the picture. ;D
Or perhaps them?
(https://i.postimg.cc/0NB3QBFQ/FBFC9485-C6-EE-45-AE-BFAA-C692-A72516-AA.jpg)
It looks to me like a platypus dived in between a bunch of cats, looking for warmth! :haw:
I found another free site:
https://www.mage.space/ (https://www.mage.space/)
I found another free site:
https://www.mage.space/ (https://www.mage.space/)
JoB, a little context maybe?Umh ... what kind of context are you missing? This is a thread on AI-generated art (with extensive discussion of how the AIs currently still miss the mark), Cervelet received a sketch request that was somewhat poorly worded (see mid-height left of the picture), joked about being tempted to feed it into an AI, and when he actually did, he found it to be far less hilariously off kilter than he would have expected (see author's comment below) ...
The young skald student who wants to be a Reclaimer? Always wondered what happened to Saga.
AI images make me imagine the lives of the people depicted. Maybe other people have the same reaction. Does anyone think it would be good to put occasional portraits here for contemplation, maybe producing new stories outside of canon?
The portrait can be almost anyone.
Interesting face. I wonder who he is? He looks both scholarly and dangerous.
Also his hands! And the extra? Driver’s? Hand behind him!Hands seem to be an ongoing problem indeed. Optimized coprocessors (https://www.collectedcurios.com/sequentialart.php?s=1226) might be an interim solution. >:D
Also it’s a scary thought that AI will drive all artists to the ground. Obviously for the artists, but on the slightly longer run for the entirety of our culture. There are many variations an AI can produce if it has the entire internet as irs corpus. However, even a huge corpus is finite. If humans cease making original art, then the AIs just recycle the same ingredients over and over again. This soup is going to go rancid. Soon.
AI won't, it will just blend the most popular handful of features it finds - that's why when you try to create a young man portrait you either get the strong jaw of a Western model/actor, or the delicate and very curated beauty of a Kpop idol, and very little in between.Unless, of course, the human prompting the image specifically requests other traits (https://www-tagesschau-de.translate.goog/faktenfinder/ki-desinformation-fakes-101.html?_x_tr_sl=de&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=de&_x_tr_pto=wapp). I wonder whether we'll ever see AI refusing requests, like a human artist might ...
Have you ever read the novel The Silver Eggheads’ by Fritz Lieber. Similar theme but with AIs writing. Subplots about writing, sexual oppression, robots discovering real creativity, and oldfashioned rollicking fun. Worth reading.... I wonder who exactly you're asking that? :3 Gadzooks, I wasn't even born when that one was published ...
Unless, of course, the human prompting the image specifically requests other traits (https://www-tagesschau-de.translate.goog/faktenfinder/ki-desinformation-fakes-101.html?_x_tr_sl=de&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=de&_x_tr_pto=wapp). I wonder whether we'll ever see AI refusing requests, like a human artist might ...
Have you ever read the novel The Silver Eggheads’ by Fritz Lieber. Similar theme but with AIs writing. Subplots about writing, sexual oppression, robots discovering real creativity, and oldfashioned rollicking fun. Worth reading.
I actually meant that for you and Sc0ut, as part of the discussion about AI art endlessly recycling the live art of humans.Ah, I see. I was a bit confused because while the link I posted is about RL people feeding art AIs some ethically dubious tasks, which they happily fulfill, in The Silver Eggheads, robots supposedly did not only absorb the position of writers but also serve as government censors, so they're supposedly quite adequate for that job. If more philistine-slash-conflicted than historic human censors hopefully ever were.
I don't know whether art AI refuses any prompts but ChatGPT refuses to engage with prompts that contain swearwords, so far.A simple swear word filter? Seriously? It's been some 20 years since I worked as an external sysadmin at a bank and heard firsthand of the failures of the one their e-mail server used ... (as in, the day where the filter manufacturer thought it a good idea to match swearwords in compound words, too - who woulda thunk anyone'd send his bank a "doCUMent", eh? - or the poor customer whose e-mails were constantly blocked due to them containing his family name ...)
JoB, those machine censors can be very silly. Even earlier in this forum, I remember talking to someone, I think it was Keep Looking, about a Western Australian wildflower called Ptilotus spathulatus, Mulla Mulla or Pussytails. The plant has fluffy flowers that look a bit like the tail of a very fluffy kitten. The name got automatically censored by the program looking out for bad words. Silly. I think Miss Blushes would have had more sense!Yeah, I remember the forum having an autocensor function (replacing, e.g., the F-bomb like here -> duck) and occasional discussions thereon. But then again, we don't go boasting that our forum qualifies as "an AI", with all the computing power and training that label suggests being at work, do we. ;)
As for using existing art as references for new art, though, I'm sorry, Sc0ut - artists have been doing that forever. Art students throughout history have been encouraged to outright copy the old masters for centuries, and the masters (living or not) didn't receive any residual income when their work inspired other work. Copyright law is a slightly complex can of worms that I won't open right now, but I will say there is nothing illegal (that I know of) about viewing art and using it as material for new art. There's even some latitude for appropriating pieces of an artwork - like sampling music - and making new art with a mixture of the pieces.
Wow, @Sc0ut , I'm really sorry you took my statements that way. The last thing I intended was to upset you (or anyone), so I apologize for that.
I definitely am not intending to talk down to anyone. I just wanted to speak accessibly, and I used the expression “robots” instead of “deep learning models developed to generate digital images from natural language descriptions” to keep the conversation casual. No insult to anyone's intelligence was intended!
I earn my living by making art for people, too – we're on the same team here!
I'm glad you're sharing your experience (and materials) in helping other people express themselves through art – please keep up the good work!
And thank you for drawing out (no pun intended) the distinctions between what is legal and what is ethical. And the point about artists of younger generations not interfering with their teachers' work is well made, too.
And since ambitious software engineers have created software that has had (I believe) unintended consequences for creators worldwide, it will be people like you and me that will have to respectfully find ways to advocate for those creators. Please believe me, @Sc0ut – I am in full support of your artistic contributions to the world, and I want to see them continue!
Speaking of which, where can I see some of your work? Is your tumblr the best place to go?
Right now it occurs to me that the phenomenon that is called AI hallucinating, when it’s asked to provide facts such as the legal brief, is exactly what is being asked for in the art generation use, isn’t it just?
I don't feel great telling people not to use AI image generators because I know it's a creative outlet for people without a lot of time or without skills to draw, and I don't think that is *in principle* a bad thing to have. But as long as the tool is developed in such an unethical way, I would urge everyone to think twice whether you want to give traffic and visibility to those sites.
it feels like a lot of "yolo let's build a thing and never think or dream or care about social or legal consequences/responsibilities" things are seeing consequences a bit (and not enough by far) lately.Yeah, who would ever want to busy himself with 'em scary German compound nouns, like how they extended "IT" into the subfield of "Technikfolgenabschätzung". [/sarcasm]
The three laws of robotics make sense you know.Ugh, not quite! The Three Laws (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Three_Laws_of_Robotics) were meant to be a believable attempt at humanity's robot regulation in stories, and certainly mirror some baselines of human ethics, but exposing/exploiting the incompleteness and/or lack of definition in the stories was pretty much the point of having them spelled out so clearly in the first place.
Perhaps a certain horse-like entity we all know and love has finally gotten a decent job?Well, if you count the rider's three legs (one supposedly hidden behind the horse, and the visible two assembled into one) as well and do not discount for it being a lowrider¹, you do get eight legs in total ...
If anyone wants to try AI-generated art at home, here (https://stable-diffusion-art.com/install-windows/) is a site with good instructions on installing it. The resulting images are quite good, though it fails on my usual test prompt ("ferret sleeping on red pillow") and fails dramatically on "anomalocaris". Though all the AI art generators I've tried fail on "anomalocaris", so that's no surprise.
Heh. The social media team of the Freiburg PD had a try, asking for a symbol "photo" for their mounted squad, "top-class appearance, nice background, sympathetic and citizen-friendly, a memorable picture".
They had enough snark to post the result (https://www.facebook.com/PolizeiFreiburg/posts/pfbid02JdvpkQFJhby25G4V2UviEnsuuLb69Yq4SSdhk59mQg2Ap2sKExacc9q3piAQ9Jyil) ... ;D
(Edit: PD, not PO.)
I haven't tried to jailbreak the AIs, but I've found you can lead them to discussions that they would otherwise reject. I've had some chats with Claude.ai about my objections to certain murder mysteries. If I just say, "Is it really plausible that this criminal plan would work?", Claude will say it's not allowed to propose criminal actions. But if I talk about the characters and the plot, I can lead it back to the criminal plan, and it will discuss the plan and the problems with it.Yeah, it seems that for now, the relevant form of "hacking" around AIs is humans hacking the AI - user vs. owner (https://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2023/11/extracting-gpts-training-data.html), non-user vs. corporate user (https://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2023/08/hacking-ai-resume-screening-with-text-in-a-white-font.html) (repeatedly (https://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2020/09/hacking_ai-grad.html)), non-user vs. users (https://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2023/07/fooling-an-ai-article-writer.html), users vs. the law (https://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2023/04/using-llms-to-create-bioweapons.html) (repeatedly (https://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2023/07/automatically-finding-prompt-injection-attacks.html)), users vs. users (https://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2022/10/adversarial-ml-attack-that-secretly-gives-a-language-model-a-point-of-view.html) (repeatedly (https://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2023/07/indirect-instruction-injection-in-multi-modal-llms.html)), trainers vs. users (https://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2021/07/hiding-malware-in-ml-models.html) (repeatedly (https://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2024/01/poisoning-ai-models.html)), users vs. "the system" (https://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2023/07/disabling-self-driving-cars-with-a-traffic-cone.html) (there's actually gamification (https://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2023/07/practice-your-security-prompting-skills.html) for that), you name it.