Can I ask how the community generally handles this? I've refrained from getting involved because I don't know how well I could keep my cool, but I really hope I don't have to quit the comments section on this webcomic like I did the last two because they stopped being enjoyable to read. :(
Ah. So stand still and stay silent. Gotcha.
Dang, you beat me to it.
Not knowing if there is a procedure in place, may I suggest one that has worked fairly well in another community I read at?There's one teensy tiny problem with that, there is no moderator besides Minna herself for the Disqus comments, so large-handed flagging would threaten to overload the resources that we'ld rather have make more comic pages ...
1. Flag troll.
2. Reply "Flagged and ignored" to troll post. Only those words.Ugh. Most trolls I've seen would see that as you confronting them and challenge you to "prove your ridiculous claim", which means that you're instantly in the defense.
I suspect JoB is on it.... muh? I have no official function on Disqus, nor on this here forum ...
uh.....I mean the comments is definitely rude, but I don't see how the third comment is a troll? I think it's just a very poorly worded criticism. Not enough to justify being flagged as troll/spam?It wasn't so much what they said there (though that was also kinda mean), but when other people said "I like the pace" and gave piles of evidence for Stuff Happening (even if there weren't grosslings or fire), they dismissed it as "fanboying"
uh.....I mean the comments is definitely rude, but I don't see how the third comment is a troll? I think it's just a very poorly worded criticism. Not enough to justify being flagged as troll/spam?
Also, JoB, your second link goes to one of your own comments, are you reporting yourself? ;)
This. I hope this community's definition of a troll isn't "someone who dares to criticize the perfect work of our lady and saviour" because then you're gonna have to ban me too. I've made almost the same comment as this guy a long time ago, and have criticized other things about the comic as well. The guy did give a somewhat rude reply to Aliax, but that's certainly not enough to call one a troll (I haven't seen other comments by him). He just said what he feels about the comic - and if I were Minna, I'd like to know these things. Some people aren't very pleasant but don't mean to cause trouble. Just don't engage with them and their comment gets drowned soon enough.
I agree that the person is within his rights to criticize the comic (which I remember Aliax doing quite a bit a few weeks back);Two weeks and two days ago, precisely. And nobody called me a troll.
the issue is the rude way he was responding to people who attempted to respectfully disagree with him. "I didn't even bother to read your response because it's just stupid fanboying"? Yeah, that crossed a line.Seriously, people, just go read the thread. This guy is a *textbook* internet troll.
uh.....I mean the comments is definitely rude, but I don't see how the third comment is a troll? I think it's just a very poorly worded criticism. Not enough to justify being flagged as troll/spam?It's a definite possibility that the occasional "merely rude" comment gets mistaken for trolling when trolling is going on, I'm afraid. It's not like the trolls would want to make themselves recognized easily. What they do want is to get people worked up and switching away from the topics they used to discuss before - and rudeness is right up that alley ...
Also, JoB, your second link goes to one of your own comments, are you reporting yourself? ;)I didn't write that one.
There's been a few "JoB replying to JoB" comments lately. I suspect it's not humor on his part, but a troll using the same nickname (but we can't see the difference because neither is a registered Disqus account). I've been confused tooI registered when the impersonations continued for two or three days. Point is, "JoB" and "JoB2" were obviously taken (registration refused), then I registered as "JoB0", got an account ID that's actually random, but the displayed name is still "JoB". In other words: Registered users can duplicate other registered users' names as displayed just the same. (Some added effort to also copy the avatar, but.)
BTW JoB, even if you don't want to use it, maybe you should make a Disqus account (if you haven't already) to make sure no-one steals the nick. [actually there's a @JOB already, but...]
I don't necessarily advocate taking any kind of action against him, because ignoring him seems to be enough.
Two weeks and two days ago, precisely. And nobody called me a troll.
Seriously, people, just go read the thread.
He expressed a negative but somewhat well-argued opinion,Well, since you mention it: could you explain to me just what his arguments were? Because all I got was, "This comic sucks because it didn't turn out to be what I wanted it to be", which is not any kind of argument as far as I can tell ???
and got a bunch of people piling on him to silence him, some with good arguments,
(Seriously, if I were making a comic and my readers would defend me with "but so much work goes into it!! it updates daily!" I would be so ashamed.)
He became rude only after some fans made it clear that they can't bear any criticism of the comic whatsoever
I think the real problem here is that some of us just can't stand the fact that some people don't like this comic.
The community will be fine. Seriously. You don't have to reply, and you can't change their mind anyway.
For whatever's worth, here's the guy having a completely civil exchange with me: https://disqus.com/home/discussion/sssscomic/stand_still_stay_silent_webcomic_page_460/#comment-2484701080 I bet he was polite with me because, unlike most people who replied, I was fine with him not liking the comic.
This is one of the best ways to tell someone's not a troll, actually. He shuts up if he's ignored. A troll will only intensify his abuse and pick on more people until he gets banned.
I... think we're in agreement? In all honesty, it can sometimes be kind of hard to tell.Argh. Yes, we are :) Sorry, I was specifically not including you in the "people", but I forgot to mention it.
we HAVE to be able to handle not everyone liking every single aspect of the comic.But you ARE! I'm living proof of it!
Argh. Yes, we are :) Sorry, I was specifically not including you in the "people", but I forgot to mention it.
Heh, drawback of communicating without any nonverbal cues.
But you ARE! I'm living proof of it!I'm not talking about you specifically! I meant more like this, with an entire TROLL ALERT thread started up, I honestly expected worse. I am in no way endorsing the internet being a generally awful place, but the examples presented are pretty tame, even compared to other things we've seen in this very community. once i was unlucky enough to see a pretty gross doodle someone posted in the comments before minna removed it, and there has not been enough brain bleach to unsee it since.
I meant more like this, with an entire TROLL ALERT thread started up, I honestly expected worse. I am in no way endorsing the internet being a generally awful place, but the examples presented are pretty tame, even compared to other things we've seen in this very community.
There's definitely a difference between rudeness and trolling. This forum is so Anti-Conflict (which is fine, people like a place where they don't have to defend themselves) I wouldn't be surprised you guys aren't used to sort of regular-brand internet rudeness.
@Aliax: I feel like this could be cleared up on the forum :p no one can impersonate job on here, he'd just have to make a post abt it.
I meant more like this, with an entire TROLL ALERT thread started up, I honestly expected worse.I guess that that's referring to me as the thread starter? Please note that I wasn't referring to only that one instance, and I did call them "wannabe trolls" as well.
no one can impersonate job on here, he'd just have to make a post abt it.Well, I sure hope so. The account settings page (https://ssssforum.com/index.php?action=profile;area=account) does have a field to change your displayed name, it doesn't say whether it'ld enforce uniqueness of same ...
I guess that what I'm having a problem with is so much troll-ish stuff starting more or less simultaneously, and maybe that it includes outright impersonation attempts right from square one. (If you haven't seen it yet, someone posted as an unregistered "minnasundberg" today.) I smell sockpuppetry (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sockpuppet_%28Internet%29) ...
Well, I sure hope so. The account settings page (https://ssssforum.com/index.php?action=profile;area=account) does have a field to change your displayed name, it doesn't say whether it'ld enforce uniqueness of same ...
Well, I'm afraid that the first wannabe trolls have come to SSSS' Disqus section to stay ...
http://www.sssscomic.com/comic.php?page=460#comment-2483580540
http://www.sssscomic.com/comic.php?page=460#comment-2483583264
http://www.sssscomic.com/comic.php?page=460#comment-2483783307
I actually didn't see anything bad at the first 2 links. Could Minna have removed the problematic comments?No, they're unchanged as far as I can see. None of the comments individually scream "hello, I'll be your ruiner of moods for today". Part of what worries me is that we see multiple instances of borderline behavior beginning simultaneously +/- 1 day, purportedly all from different people ...
I guess that that's referring to me as the thread starter? Please note that I wasn't referring to only that one instance, and I did call them "wannabe trolls" as well.fair enough, that's bad.
I guess that what I'm having a problem with is so much troll-ish stuff starting more or less simultaneously, and maybe that it includes outright impersonation attempts right from square one. (If you haven't seen it yet, someone posted as an unregistered "minnasundberg" today.) I smell sockpuppetry (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sockpuppet_%28Internet%29) ...
As a pro-active measure I did some noodling and found pretty much everything about him, his name, his high school, college, some professors, current residence, where he works, etc. - thus if his behaviour worsens to the point where it is absolutely necessary , then, measures can be taken .I really don't think this guy is worth all that. YES, he was rude, but you guys seem to have a lot of faith in Minna, let her handle anything that gets out of control.
He also requires some schooling in exactly what his "rights" are - actually he has none ; ie: he paid nothing for this free web comic or the web comic site upkeep, and is only tolerated on the webcomic comments section by the grace of the author. She can end comments at whim and he has no right to say anything.
(the bold is my emphasis)
Technically he has already violated the terms of Disqus with his (mild) uncalled-for namecalling
As a pro-active measure I did some noodling and found pretty much everything about him, his name, his high school, college, some professors, current residence, where he works, etc. - thus if his behaviour worsens to the point where it is absolutely necessary , then, measures can be taken .
[...]gets very protective about stuff , people, and artists he likes. [...]
[...]I also do not tolerate rudeness [...]
[...]He also requires some schooling in exactly what his "rights" are - actually he has none[...]
[...]As a pro-active measure I did some noodling and found pretty much everything about him, his name, his high school, college, some professors, current residence, where he works, etc. - thus if his behaviour worsens to the point where it is absolutely necessary , then, measures can be taken . [...]
As a pro-active measure I did some noodling and found pretty much everything about him, his name, his high school, college, some professors, current residence, where he works, etc. - thus if his behaviour worsens to the point where it is absolutely necessary , then, measures can be taken .
Troll or no, this thread is bringing out the worst in a lot of people.
There will be times when new commenters appear and we don't like what they're saying. This community is getting bigger, and these things will probably happen more often now. We may think that their opinions are unfair, that their tones are rude, and that they're out to pick a fight. These things could be due to a bias in our perception, a misunderstanding gone out of hand or they may well be true! Just remember that overwhelming an unfamiliar commenter may be unintentionally creating an environment which forces them to be defensive, makes them lash out, and produces rude 'troll like' behaviour from someone who feels under attack. Equally, we have gained good community members when we've treated these disagreeing commenters decently. Your own actions can be powerful, even when you don't intend on them to be.
You can't force everyone on the internet to live to your own standards, but you can live up to them yourself. Be the change you wish to see. It may be hard to do when you feel hurt not to reply in spite, but please hold back, both on the comments and on here. You'll be creating the world you hate, and become the monster you think you're fighting and worse. One of the many wonderful things about the internet is that you can take time to think before replying, a luxury that would be very appreciated in real life. Use this time to think about what you're saying, who it can hurt and what it can do.
Hey guys, this troll issue is really not something we need to worry about. Minna is perfectly capable of handling her comment section, and we are capable of handling the forum.
Just remember that overwhelming an unfamiliar commenter may be unintentionally creating an environment which forces them to be defensive, makes them lash out, and produces rude 'troll like' behaviour from someone who feels under attack.(emphasis mine)
One of the many wonderful things about the internet is that you can take time to think before replying, a luxury that would be very appreciated in real life. Use this time to think about what you're saying, who it can hurt and what it can do.
Equally, we have gained good community members when we've treated these disagreeing commenters decently.
Be the change you wish to see.
It may be hard to do when you feel hurt not to reply in spite, but please hold back, both on the comments and on here.
Really the more important thing to be aware of is that there is someone impersonating JoB in the comments and we need to be aware that we might not be talking to JoB when we see the name in the section.Well, not necessarily only me ... I noticed the extra JoBs because I'm not a registered Disqus user and have to actually Ctrl-F through the SSSS page to notice people replying to me.
I'd also like to know why we are discussing someone essentially behind their back? *raises eyebrows*You're referring to Mr. "pacing issue" here, I take it? Well, he did effectively announce he'ld keep his back turned to our
@ everyone still reacting over that one "troll":
he's not worth your time, there will be more of them, you're not getting paid to defend minna and her work in every situation
Aliax - it's not about just you personally.
Can I take this opportunity to ask why people do what you did here? Whether it's saying, "Let it go", or "People need to stop discussing this topic" or anything of the sort? I honestly don't get it ??? To me, it seems obvious that if people are still discussing something, it's because they are still interested in the topic, so it seems very rude to me to tell them to stop talking about it. Similarly, if someone is still upset or emotional in any way over something, it seems like a complete lack of compassion to me to tell them to "just let it go". I honestly don't understand this, BUT I also refuse to conclude that people must simply be that rude or that lacking in compassion, so clearly I'm missing something here. Could you help me understand, please?
Hey guys, this troll issue is really not something we need to worry about. Minna is perfectly capable of handling her comment section, and we are capable of handling the forum.
Really the more important thing to be aware of is that there is someone impersonating JoB in the comments and we need to be aware that we might not be talking to JoB when we see the name in the section.
Otherwise, everything is fine. We've dealt with trolls in the past and Minna has too. She can and will ban people she feels are a problem from her comment section, it's happened in the past. This really isn't an issue worth arguing over. It will happen again one day and probably even more often, and we will just keep going on being the awesome community we are and not let it get to us.
I think it's more that it's unnerving to see this reaction to negative views of Minna's work
honestly I'm a bit driven away by the threats to find your personal information and offline, private life and use them against you, especially because I've had the exact same feelings that this person has expressed.
People do this because there is discord growing and they are trying to nip it in the bud.
This thread isn't a comfort corner, it was an announcement, and if you're upset and emotional (which is entirely understandable), that thread might be a better place to express your feelings
Can I take this opportunity to ask why people do what you did here?Okay, I will explain. I apoligize if I was being rude or condescending.
But you kept responding to things as if they were directed at you personally.
Aaaaalright I really don't know what the purpose of this conversation is or what you're looking for?