Post by: Joe Steele on March 07, 2020, 08:45:34 PM
1. Affects all mammals besides the blessed felines.
2. Can't survive long outside hosts.
3. Transmitted via biting, contact with infected tissue. Also spreads via air.
4. Symptoms include the characteristic rash, fever, vomiting, coma, and death.
5. Causes mutations.
6.Traps its victims in hideous, screaming mounds of flesh that have forgotten how to die. Trapped soul means nervous system still intact.
7. Killed by sunlight.
8. Weakened by cold climates.
9.Not responsive to vaccines or cure attempts.
10. Only known cure causes brain death.
My hypothesis is that it's a bioweapon. What do you all think?
Post by: Róisín on March 08, 2020, 01:00:30 AM
However, as to what it is: there are many, many possibilities. My favourites are: alien bioweapon intended to get rid of all those pesky mammals on what is otherwise a perfectly coloniseable planet; human bioweapon either escaped or carelessly/prematurely deployed; research project gone wrong; or the one that seems likeliest to me: a natural mutation of a mycobacterium, possibly permitting cross-species infection (after all, that process has already given us Buruli ulcer, leprosy and tuberculosis, among others). But I do not think it is a virus, that just doesn’t fit with the environmental constraints.
Post by: thorny on March 08, 2020, 10:52:51 AM
Post by: Róisín on March 08, 2020, 11:30:17 AM
Post by: LooNEY_DAC on March 08, 2020, 12:26:34 PM
Post by: Jitter on March 08, 2020, 06:52:33 PM
Looney_DAC’s comment got me thinking. What if the Rash is or originates from some sort of chaos magic, something like the Warp in WH40.000 or the Dungeon Dimensions of Discworld, or is simply demonic. In any case, the “dark side” of a struggle unknown to humankind. But for whatever reason the Rash attacks or escapes to or accidentally gets hurled into our dimension and into Earth, with very unfortunate consequences.
Then some of the “good guys” from there follow to fix it but discover that this world is particularly vulnerable to whatever the Rash is. So they set to doing as much damage control as is possible and assume the identity of the remaining humans’ old gods. Some of the humans are capable of acting as conduits of the power of these good guys (the mages) but most aren’t. The good guys do what they can, try to keep the survivors alive but are unable to cleanse the entire world. At least they have closed the rift or whatever it came through, so in time when the immune populations grow and more and more of the Rash creatures get killed, a healthier equilibrium will again be attained. Hopefully.
Post by: yung_chrysanthemum on March 08, 2020, 07:08:22 PM
So I'd bet that, at the very end of the story, someone (probably Onni) will be infected, injected with the serum to buy a little more time, then Reynir realizes that he can cure the rash completely. So SSSS will end on a positive note, where the rash is now curable with a combination of the serum / a mage.
(1) or more specifically, the soul could be trapped in the dream world, so the affected person isn't able to resume consciousness. This could be the origin of the malevolent spirit cluster we've seen in the dream world. This bit is all speculation, but I think it's not too ridiculous to guess that had Lalli drowned in the dream world, he probably would have died in real life as well.
e; and of course, I speculated this same exact thing in 2017 <_< just with less words
Post by: Purple Wyrm on March 08, 2020, 07:16:41 PM
Post by: thegreyarea on March 09, 2020, 07:30:44 AM
(because, as many referred, there's no way for the Rash to be just a biological illness)
It's not that those things didn't exist before, but they were restrained for centuries, which coincides with the development of science (or is caused by it?)
So someone, with or without intent, broke the balance, allowing the creation of the Rash and also the return of the old Gods and magic to Earth.
As Jitter mentioned humans acting as conduits of Light Magic, also those infected with the Rash could act as conduits of Dark Magic. That would be the source of the troll's "dark voice".
I'd also follow her idea of some trans-dimensional rift, with said rupture allowing a greater "flow" of energies and/or upper-dimensional beings into our (unprepared) plane of existence. (and it could happen that what happened on Earth was just a small skirmish (or should we say collateral damage?) in the greater scheme of things).
Post by: wavewright62 on March 09, 2020, 04:05:44 PM
As mentioned, there is another thread (https://ssssforum.com/index.php?topic=18.0) devoted to speculation on the origins of the Rash, with some repetition with this thread. However, since that thread left off in 2016, there has been an awful lot of comic and exposition gone by. Do have a read, lots of wonderful theories (!), but I don't see a need to merge these threads at this time.
(mod hat - OFF)
Holy smokes, yung_chrysanthemum, what an ending to the tale that would be!!
Post by: Jitter on March 09, 2020, 04:17:26 PM
Post by: LilG on March 09, 2020, 04:52:09 PM
Under spoiler for block of text (and excessive theorizing).
Spoiler: show
).
.Now, where the rash came from we might never know, since Minna has stated multiple times that she wouldn’t reveal the origins of the rash, unless maybe she wants to take the story in that direction, but I think revealing that the rash also affects the spirit world would keep the mystery alive, since not even the gods (or at least what’s left of them) would know where it came from if or when we get to see them in the story.
Post by: Joe Steele on March 09, 2020, 07:06:04 PM
a natural mutation of a mycobacterium, possibly permitting cross-species infection (after all, that process has already given us Buruli ulcer, leprosy and tuberculosis, among others).I looked this up, and it seems possible that a strain of mycobacterium, maybe M. tuberculosis or M. ulcerans, is to blame for the rash. The symptoms and carriers match up eerily well. However, mycobacteria such as tuberculosis are deadlier in cold climates, meaning the Spanish Rash probably isn't one of them.
Post by: thorny on March 11, 2020, 11:19:03 AM
Bear in mind that the governments of, at least, the Known World were closing borders even before there had been any deaths.
page 8, day 0, Iceland planning to close borders
http://www.sssscomic.com/comic.php?page=8
page 13, day 3, Denmark closing borders:
http://www.sssscomic.com/comic.php?page=13
page 14, still I think day 3: illness was first diagnosed only five days prior, the first patients had arrived on a boat only the week before, and the Rash had caused no fatalities at that point. (While some of this may have been for public info, the information we do have otherwise indicates that the Rash does indeed take more than five days to kill.)
http://www.sssscomic.com/comic.php?page=14
page 34, day 5: first deaths, no recoveries, first patients are entering fourth week of infection, and are acknowledged to be comatose.
http://www.sssscomic.com/comic.php?page=34
So Iceland and Denmark both closed borders within 5 days of the first official diagnosis, and before any deaths had occurred.
And that is just plain implausibly fast unless people high up in the governments of Iceland and Denmark knew a whole lot more about the Rash than anybody was letting on. Nobody closes borders of even a city, let alone an entire country, for a disease that's only been known for five days and from which nobody has yet died.
Post by: yung_chrysanthemum on March 11, 2020, 02:40:40 PM
Whatever the Rash is, and however it happened, I think we have to posit that at least some people in some governments had inside info about it very near the start.
my guess personally would be that the country hosting patient zero was sharing detailed information on their condition with other nations, since the illness was so bizarre (and the patients were probably all comatose when they were located). as for whether the rash was possibly manmade, i don't think we have much to go on there.
Post by: Jitter on March 11, 2020, 05:47:23 PM
And thorny’s insight is very important! It could well be that the way Iceland was saved by the gods could be divine intervention to make them close borders at the time. Remember they didn’t leave any time for their citizens abroad to return so they must have been extremely determined. There is a thriving and officially recognized religious community of the worshippers of the Norse gods in Iceland in the present day real world, so it could be plausible to think there was a communication channel open.
Post by: thorny on March 11, 2020, 07:02:54 PM
my guess personally would be that the country hosting patient zero was sharing detailed information on their condition with other nations, since the illness was so bizarre (and the patients were probably all comatose when they were located). as for whether the rash was possibly manmade, i don't think we have much to go on there.
Yes, I don't think that's evidence that the rash was human made in Iceland and/or Denmark (though of course it's not evidence that it wasn't, either; or even evidence that it wasn't made somewhere that didn't close borders at all, humans being as dimwitted as we sometimes are); but what I'm saying is that it's evidence that the countries that closed borders in time for that to help had knowledge, from some source, that told them -- within five days! -- that this was worse than Ebola and spreading faster than novel coronavirus. Because that's not how the world's reacted to either of those -- what borders did get closed IRL were around places already infected, while places not yet having serious problems continued to trade with one another; and what closings there have been took much longer to happen, and they've been permeable not only by accident but by design.
The evidence might have been from the gods. Or it might have been some other sort of direct push by gods or by magic that wasn't by means of giving that information, as I think Jitter is suggesting. Or it might have been information derived from studying plague victims actually discovered and sequestered well before any of the public announcements, traded in secret among a few people some of whom were at high levels of government. Or it might have been because people did make the rash, either as part of some plan or by accident; and were trying either by long-term plan or just because that was who they could reach to limit damage in certain areas. I don't think we've got enough information to say that any of those are either right or wrong. But somebody knew something.
Post by: thegreyarea on March 12, 2020, 11:46:26 AM
1st (and my preferred), if Iceland closed it's borders thanks to privileged info from the gods, than we may assume that the Norse gods maintain good relations with the Japanese ones, because Japan was the second country to close it's borders (and, BTW, that's a lot harder for Japan to do it, because it has much more population and connections with the rest of the World, not to mention economic interests).
2nd,if the information regarding the danger of the Rash was well established at a restrict governmental level, we may think that it could have been a previous rash outbreak, maybe years before the Y0, that somehow was contained and studied, leaving a few people with the knowledge that, one day, it could (would?) happen again. We could call it a "Black Mesa" situation... (https://half-life.fandom.com/wiki/Black_Mesa_Incident), or maybe one of those atomic tests in the 60's was not a test...
Post by: thorny on March 12, 2020, 12:17:50 PM
Japan was the second country to close it's borders (and, BTW, that's a lot harder for Japan to do it, because it has much more population and connections with the rest of the World, not to mention economic interests).
Plus which, Japan imports more than half of its food supply!
And that isn't just because they're not in the habit of growing it. It's because of a serious imbalance between population and arable land.
I'd entirely forgotten that Japan was the second country to close. The people who made that decision absolutely must have known something. A huge percentage of the people must have starved to death there; and even if they expected a temporary closure, I expect there would have been hunger quite soon.
2nd,if the information regarding the danger of the Rash was well established at a restrict governmental level, we may think that it could have been a previous rash outbreak, maybe years before the Y0, that somehow was contained and studied, leaving a few people with the knowledge that, one day, it could (would?) happen again. We could call it a "Black Mesa" situation... (https://half-life.fandom.com/wiki/Black_Mesa_Incident), or maybe one of those atomic tests in the 60's was not a test...
"Nuke it from space" or at least "nuke it via detonator"?
I think that would almost have to have made it a deliberate experiment that went wrong; because a natural outbreak, again, almost certainly would have spread before people found out enough about it to realize that they needed to nuke it.
-- Both of those would make interesting fanfics, I agree.
Post by: Jitter on March 12, 2020, 12:48:54 PM
Grey, brilliant ideas! Maybe a UFO crashed and the lifeforms within were totally weird and grotesque, the US tried to study them first but understood it was too dangerous and nuked the site?
Post by: Róisín on March 12, 2020, 07:44:14 PM
Post by: thegreyarea on March 12, 2020, 10:00:28 PM
I think that would almost have to have made it a deliberate experiment that went wrong; because a natural outbreak, again, almost certainly would have spread before people found out enough about it to realize that they needed to nuke it.Well, it also could be an accidental (magical) outbreak caused by natural events. You can put here the old trope of stars and/or planets aligned in a precise manner in a precise day/hour, or something more unusual like a flood unearthing an ancient artifact (terrestrial or alien or upper-dimensional) that someone accidentally activates... And here's another possible fanfic! :)
-- Both of those would make interesting fanfics, I agree.
I'm already working on one of those, but things are far from finished. :)
Incidentally (or not) the Japanese of modern days also still respect their kami and keep good relations with them. The Norse and Japanese gods may have cooperated (or the Finnish and Japanese - maybe the kami also like moomins?) or it's just a question of someone being around to hear the warning from the old gods in two separate occasions.The Japanese have many gods and spirits. Some are more like the Norse gods, while others are more connected with nature and resemble the Finnish. I like to think that all these gods have ways to communicate with each other, be it a "Heavenet" Forum or a bar... https://www.umsabadoqualquer.com/category/deuses/
Grey, brilliant ideas! Maybe a UFO crashed and the lifeforms within were totally weird and grotesque, the US tried to study them first but understood it was too dangerous and nuked the site?
(this is the link for the translated version that I did: https://i.postimg.cc/9fTpHhmM/2844-translated.jpg )
I liked your idea to put the UFO in the mix! :) I'm working on that story already... let's see if it's ready before Y90 :D
Which raises the fascinating question of the similarities in our world between Finnish and Japanese traditional magics. ... Fascinating concept, and might explain why in-comic their gods might communicate or be related.
I agree, Róisín. It's an interesting link.
(but the landbridge that you refer wasn't in the Bering Strait, between Asia and America?)
Post by: LooNEY_DAC on March 13, 2020, 12:59:42 AM
...maybe the world leaders/medical people panicked because the patients looked like the last photo here (http://sssscomic.com/comic.php?page=275), which was approximately the stage they were at when the border closures began.
Post by: thegreyarea on March 13, 2020, 06:32:16 AM
To make a slightly more prosaic solution...If you think at it for a while that may be one of the most (if not the most) terrifying pages of this comic.
...maybe the world leaders/medical people panicked because the patients looked like the last photo here (http://sssscomic.com/comic.php?page=275), which was approximately the stage they were at when the border closures began.
And I'm still waiting for an arc in this comic related with that book/journal. Will it be on the 3rd adventure?
Post by: LilG on March 13, 2020, 05:05:42 PM
Considering what the gods can and cannot do, let’s near in mind that the Norse gods or the Finnish ones aren’t supposed to be almighty. The Norse gods battle with the giants all the time (except when they are fighting amongst themselves) and aren’t by any means always victorious. So the fact that they haven’t saved the entire humanity does not necessarily mean they aren’t around at all.
I know they aren’t omnipotent, sorry if I made it sound like I believed that when I started talking about them (I might have exaggerated by saying they would “rid the world of the illness once and for all”). I meant to say that, by now, 90 years into the future, if they would have came to Earth at some point during the century, they would have made significantly more progress in expanding the Known World, even if they sometimes lost some battles in the process and had to retreat and regroup. Omnipotence wouldn’t be required of them to at least show up and help with the cleanup, while at the same time granting powers to the ones that seem worthy of them, like they do in the comic. If they didn’t have anything to worry about regarding the rash and the well-being of their own world, then coming to Earth should have been their first course of action.
But again, if they were also affected by the rash then that would explain the unwillingness of the few that survived to stay in the physical world, since it wouldn’t be any better than just staying in Tuonela (going with the theory that it’s a refuge for the surviving deities). Wether they stayed there or came to Earth, they would still only be able to bless humans, since, if they ever were to start a crusade to reclaim the “Silent Lands” they would most likely die and then there would be no one left to continue gifting powers.
Also, on the topic of omnipotence, I think we have to assume that there are no omnipotent gods in the ssss universe, as that would pretty much make the story unnecessary. Let’s take for example the Catholic God. If he were omnipotent then the rash wouldn’t have happened at all, erased Thanos-style with a snap of his fingers. Also, if he were somehow corrupted by the rash (going with the idea that the rash is literally out of this world, hence out of his control) he would have became as hellbent on killing all the still living humans as all the other trolls on Earth and, with a simple though, destroy everything. And this would go the same with all the presumed to be omnipotent gods of the real world.
And thorny’s insight is very important! It could well be that the way Iceland was saved by the gods could be divine intervention to make them close borders at the time. Remember they didn’t leave any time for their citizens abroad to return so they must have been extremely determined. There is a thriving and officially recognized religious community of the worshippers of the Norse gods in Iceland in the present day real world, so it could be plausible to think there was a communication channel open.
I suppose that might also be true, though I don’t see what sacrifices the Icelanders believe the gods had to make in order for them to survive (adv 1 page 67), other than wasting a few minutes to tell them “Hey, you better close your borders or you’ll end up über fkd”, if they objectively know (not just believe) that the gods helped them.
But, even if this were true, it wouldn’t mean that they survived following that short exchange of words. I think them warning Iceland would actually be in favor of the theory that they were also affected by the rash. Because, if the gods warned them before even the first patients started trollifing, then they must have known what the plague was capable of doing. And, since they’re not omniscient, wouldn’t seeing it affect their own people (before spilling over into the physical world) be the only way they could have known about the danger?
Post by: Jitter on March 13, 2020, 07:14:28 PM
Thegreyarea, you mean like a color out of space?
Post by: thegreyarea on March 13, 2020, 09:30:59 PM
LilG, I definitely agree there are no omnipotent gods here!Well, about Omnipotent Gods, they usually make any story a lot less interesting, unless they self-limit their actions for some only-god-knows reason, implying that they either don't care (at best) or promote (at worst) human suffering...
Thegreyarea, you mean like a color out of space?
Makes me remember why as I grow up (but still a kid), I disliked, more and more, the Superman stories. He was obviously overpowered, making (almost) mandatory that plots gravitated around kryptonite, which in turn made them boring.
A color out of space plot device would definitively be one way to introduce the Rash on our world, but, as was discussed before, that solution would need to address the connection between extraterrestrial origin and very terrestrial magical/supernatural legends... It's not easy to balance both in a coherent way (and by that I mean without gigantic plot-holes).
BTW I'm really working on a story that includes those elements, inspired by this thread, and particularly by your comments :) It's coming out nicely, I believe. Since we're now in a kind of country-wide (continent-wide?) lockdown I'll be working from home in the coming times (weeks?) and will probably have a little more time to write and other SSSS things... And here I'm, again, trying to see the half-full glass! :-)
Post by: Jitter on March 14, 2020, 11:18:16 AM
Post by: Mariiii on March 15, 2020, 12:26:33 PM
To return to the main topic of this thread, I think that maybe someone rediscovered magic and tried to make some experiments with it and that one of this experiences was to modify a virus or a bacteria by magic and this created the pathogenic agent responsible for the rash. After, I don't know if it would be intentional or not, and it also could be a natural modification which would have happen in a totally natural way like thegreyarea said.
Post by: thegreyarea on March 15, 2020, 02:32:15 PM
... But my main point is that maybe the gods doesn't really exist in SSSS and that they are a concept created by humans to explain the magic, and what they believe influence their capacities ... but I think it is more interesting if it is only about humans.The "Magic Without Gods" is an interesting proposal, that also eliminates all those questions about the absence of a more direct intervention. And there's no "talking god" in the story. We only see the effects of their "presence". Even the mystical bird summoned by Onni could be just the manifestation of Onni's powers, in the shape of a bird... And the Dream World could be some kind of "shared conscience" of humanity (imagine that all humans have telepathic capabilities that work on a subconscious level, but those with magical powers can access that space...). So, more fuel for stories! :)
... I don't know if it would be intentional or not, and it also could be a natural modification which would have happen in a totally natural way like thegrayarea said.
As for a totally natural way, It could be, why not? Earth could just happened to enter a interstellar cloud of magical energy as the galaxy rotated. If those clouds had different densities it would explain variations on magical presence in the world along centuries. (and even more fuel for stories, yeah!)
But what I meant was more a natural (accidental) trigger to supernatural events, like that example of a flood that exposes a powerful artifact.
Post by: Mariiii on March 15, 2020, 08:13:22 PM
And the Dream World could be some kind of "shared conscience" of humanity (imagine that all humans have telepathic capabilities that work on a subconscious level, but those with magical powers can access that space...). So, more fuel for stories! :)
As for a totally natural way, It could be, why not? Earth could just happened to enter a interstellar cloud of magical energy as the galaxy rotated. If those clouds had different densities it would explain variations on magical presence in the world along centuries. (and even more fuel for stories, yeah!)
But what I meant was more a natural (accidental) trigger to supernatural events, like that example of a flood that exposes a powerful artifact.
Well I never thought about the Dream World as something else, what did you think about it ? For me it always was kind of place where every mages can meet in spirit during their dreams (if they are close in reality, because it seems like the more distant they are in reality, harder it is for them to contact each other if they can't travel safely through the sea like Reynir). And the troll spirits seems to have access to this place as well (for example the dog in the first adventure). I also wonder if the big aquatic serpents who tried to drown Lalli are trolls or something else because we never meet them in the reality... O_O
I really like the idea of interstellar clouds of magic energy, these could also explain why the magic "disappeared" from the world, and they could also be at the origin of the illness!
About the artifact theory, did you imagine that a bunch of people found it, got infected and became the first ones to contract the rash ?
But yes, there is so many stories or theories we could write about it ! I really hope we will get answers to theses questions as the story goes on... ;D
Post by: thegreyarea on March 16, 2020, 05:41:29 AM
Well I never thought about the Dream World as something else, what did you think about it ? For me it always was kind of place where every mages can meet in spirit during their dreams (if they are close in reality, because it seems like the more distant they are in reality, harder it is for them to contact each other if they can't travel safely through the sea like Reynir). And the troll spirits seems to have access to this place as well (for example the dog in the first adventure). I also wonder if the big aquatic serpents who tried to drown Lalli are trolls or something else because we never meet them in the reality... O_O
I really like the idea of interstellar clouds of magic energy, these could also explain why the magic "disappeared" from the world, and they could also be at the origin of the illness!
About the artifact theory, did you imagine that a bunch of people found it, got infected and became the first ones to contract the rash ?
But yes, there is so many stories or theories we could write about it ! I really hope we will get answers to theses questions as the story goes on... ;D
I see two possibilities for the Dream World (with many variations...):
a) The Dream World is that, a Dream, but a shared dream, accessible by telepathic power.
b) The Dream World is that, a World, but in another dimension, accessible by magic power.
In both options we need to switch off from the real world to gain access.
In a) the mind connects with the "dream internet", but all "data processing" happens inside the minds of those connected. If everybody was simultaneously awaken you would not be able to connect and will remain on your dream inside your mind.
In b) the conscience, while still attached to the body, enters another world/dimension, that exists by itself. Keeping with the computer analogy, the "processing" happens, mostly, in a big server. Even if everybody else in the world is awaken you can still go inside.
That last option is somehow supported by that moment when Reynir (someone gave him admin powers but forgot to tell :) ) enters on Lalli dream world while Lalli is trapped in Emil's mind.
The big serpent can be something that inhabits just that world, or the projection of the mind of something very big (it seems that minds retain a large similarity with their real world bodies, we never saw someone turning in an animal or changing size, except for the children versions on Lalli's island dream/memory). So it could be the mind of a sea-serpent? Minna already draw big sea serpents a few times. I recall the ones under the ship on page 55 (adv 1) and on page 31 (adv 2). So maybe that's it?
I also love the interstellar cloud theory and will, with time, try to write something using it.
On the artifact hypothesis it could be either your approach (the artifact contains the infectious agent) or the artifact unlocks a connection with another dimension, a gate through which one, or several, evil entities access our world and their actions cause the disease.
As you said, many stories could be made. I'm also very curious about Minna's answers to all (or part of) that, if we ever get some. Will Minna ever write her "Silmarillion"?
Post by: LilG on March 16, 2020, 06:47:10 AM
The big serpent can be something that inhabits just that world, or the projection of the mind of something very big (it seems that minds retain a large similarity with their real world bodies, we never saw someone turning in an animal or changing size, except for the children versions on Lalli's island dream/memory). So it could be the mind of a sea-serpent? Minna already draw big sea serpents a few times. I recall the ones under the ship on page 55 (adv 1) and on page 31 (adv 2). So maybe that's it?
On the topic of what the things in the water are:
(https://66.media.tumblr.com/30432481fae00c8c871f21c164c8d992/5e7a24ca6c0bd531-40/s640x960/b73f7888abcef9d288fcdf5b6173f6165b84615f.png)
(screenshot taken from a post on Key posts by Minna through the comments and on Twitch, though I don't remember the exact post)
She doesn't specifically say what they are, but she does compare them to native spirits of the Spirit/ Dream World.
So... I guess mystery somewhat solved?
Though, as I've stated previously in my first post here, she might be lying so as to not spoil the story. I don't really see that being the case here because her answer, while vague, sounds quite well put together, but maybe I'm just biased because it wouldn't fit my theory about magic as a whole for it to not be true ¯\_(ツ)_/¯.
Post by: Mariiii on March 16, 2020, 07:16:29 AM
She doesn't specifically say what they are, but she does compare them to native spirits of the Spirit/ Dream World.
So... I guess mystery somewhat solved?
Though, as I've stated previously in my first post here, she might be lying so as to not spoil the story. I don't really see that being the case here because her answer, while vague, sounds quite well put together, but maybe I'm just biased because it wouldn't fit my theory about magic as a whole for it to not be true ¯\_(ツ)_/¯.
Yes it seems like the mystery is solved, thank you ! ;D
Post by: thegreyarea on March 16, 2020, 07:39:31 AM
On the topic of what the things in the water are:
She doesn't specifically say what they are, but she does compare them to native spirits of the Spirit/ Dream World.
So... I guess mystery somewhat solved?
Thanks! I didn't knew about that. (looks like I haven't did enough digging in the Forum yet...)
Yes it seems like the mystery is solved, thank you ! ;D
So, yes, mystery solved! But also her answer strongly points to the Dream World having an existence of it own, like Tuonela. (hypothesis b) from my previous post)
Post by: Mariiii on March 16, 2020, 09:11:26 AM
Thanks! I didn't knew about that. (looks like I haven't did enough digging in the Forum yet...)
So, yes, mystery solved! But also her answer strongly points to the Dream World having an existence of it own, like Tuonela. (hypothesis b) from my previous post)
Me too, there are so many different topics, it will take a lot of time to see everything ;D
Yes that's true, it is also the hypothesis that seems the most realistic to me. I still like the idea of it being created by the imagination and beliefs of humanity, and only mages are able to conscioulsy access or interact with this world. We saw that normal people also have their own spaces in this "dimension" since Lalli has been able to go in Emil space...But they seem to be underwater instead of being on the surface, so maybe it is linked to the magic ablity ?
Post by: Queen Yoko on April 08, 2021, 08:15:59 PM
🦇🦇🦇🦇🦇🦇🦇🦇🦇🦇🦇🦇🦇🦇
I mean flying infected beasts would be a threat to everyone and every thing near them. ( I mean the rash is an airborne pathogen so....yeah)
I’m kind of hopping Mina talks about the world’s only flying mammal family at some point, because I can’t get the thought out of my head now.
Post by: muidole on April 09, 2021, 01:00:59 AM
In any case, that's what I'm choosing to believe regarding rash infected bats haha
Post by: Jitter on April 09, 2021, 01:08:01 AM
I think this is a good call by her, since flying animals with the Rash would seriously push the believability of the survival as presented, possibly over the edge into “there is No Way they could have survived”.
Post by: Maglor on April 09, 2021, 08:14:56 AM
1. Lowered/absent need in food may be explained by ability to feed via mycelium, that mutants can grow, when not moving.
2. Mutations may be explained by fusing an infected body and a fungi. So those are not mutations, it's rather a deformations.
3. Sun (UV) and cold might be just a unwanted conditions for a fungi.
4. Pandemic character of the Rush may also be explained by it's fungal nature. The fact that we don't see mutated plants means we're dealing with an animal-specialized fungi. Cats might just happend to be immnune to this.
5. Obvious parralels with The Last Of Us, lol.
6. "Trapped soul" may be explained by the presumption that the fungi needs it's victim neural system still operating in order to control the infected body and percept the world around. But this is where weird things starts. If there is such thing as a "soul" it is most certainly contained in the same place with consciousness - the neocortex, which for any worthy parasitic fungi is the first thing to kill. However we know that trolls are still aware.
7. The following theory is buit on idea I used to build my own LORe for the story that have nothing to do with 4S. But this idea might still work.
So. Carl Gustav Jung. The collective unconsciousness. You heard of it, right? What if the Rush was a manmade GM-fungi meant to amplify and alter human neural system in a way that would allow the collective unconsciousness aka "The dream world" to become a real thing? Imagine the possibilities! Things gone terribly wrong, but because of it we also have magic and gods.
Post by: Róisín on April 09, 2021, 10:05:05 AM
I do imagine the rash as having some sort of linked hive-mind among its victims, with the return of magic being a last effort of the human collective unconscious to survive.
Post by: Queen Yoko on April 09, 2021, 05:43:43 PM
I think the idea might have been brought up before and a proposed answer was that any rash infected bats would be too horribly mutated to fly? So they would all basically be grounded and unable to get airborne?
............
In any case, that's what I'm choosing to believe regarding rash infected bats haha
Yeah that makes sense. Flight involves a lot of different factors being just right. (weight, thrust, air displacement , that sort of stuff) And all the trolls we’ve seen are bloated or distorted far from third original forms. So yeah that explanation FLYS.
I apologize, that pun was horrible. ;P
Post by: Queen Yoko on April 09, 2021, 06:03:42 PM
I like the idea that the rash somehow arose naturally. There’s a kind of poetry in story’s where Mother Nature kicks mankind in the teeth and proves that we aren’t as in control as we think we are.
I also like the idea that magic was something that was just naturally around in the pre-pelage days, and mankind, just wrote it off as superstition or psychosis, or whatever .
(By the way I’m not trying to be judgmental here or anything if you believe in magic, AWSOME! You do you. I for one am unwilling to close the door on the possibility of magic.)
Also I’m thinking virus because viruses have been know to cause mutations on a genetic level. And they tend to spend really fast, which would explain why things went downhill so fast in the prolog.
Although the fungal idea is pretty cool too. Especially since it offers an explanation as to why infected creatures seem to be clinically immortal and don’t seem to need food or water.
For my part I’m thinking it’s a virus that turns it’s host organisms tissues in to something like cancer cells.
And I haven’t fully thought out the magic component, but there’s definitely a magical component to all this somewhere........... 🤔
Post by: Queen Yoko on April 09, 2021, 06:14:49 PM
CeilingFan is right, we have Word of Minna that the Rash mutations would ground the bats.
I think this is a good call by her, since flying animals with the Rash would seriously push the believability of the survival as presented, possibly over the edge into “there is No Way they could have survived”.
😅 I’m with you. Flightless infected bats is a good call on Minna’s part.
I was thinking of the “Scorch Beasts” from “Fallout 76” when I wrote my first post here. God, those things look terrifying!
Post by: GMantis on August 05, 2021, 03:41:36 AM
I think it's a fungal infection.Feeding via mycellum still requires some food source. Since no infected creature has been shown to have roots, the only possible source is for the fungi to use the bodies of the infected, which after 90 years would make them more fungi than animal. And this hardly seems to be the case, starting with the fact that they're alive - rather unlikely in an organism that's been eaten through by fungi.
1. Lowered/absent need in food may be explained by ability to feed via mycelium, that mutants can grow, when not moving.
The rest of your post has some interesting ideas, but if the disease is supposed to be based on biology - at least partly - this seems to me an insurmountable obstacle.
Post by: thorny on August 05, 2021, 10:01:14 AM
I think we have to assume that it's running on magic. I'm also inclined to think that Minna didn't work out more of the details than she needed for any particular plot line.
Post by: Róisín on August 06, 2021, 08:33:33 PM