Author Topic: Linguistics  (Read 42958 times)

Nimphy

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Linguistics
« on: October 29, 2014, 09:38:24 AM »
Different languages, different onomatopeias, different exclamations, and much more. This thread is kind of an experiment. What do cats say in your language? What do you scream when you stub your foot? What's the noise of a brain thinking?

Italian:

- Cats go "miao"
- Dogs go "bau"
- Frogs and crows go both "cra" (although frogs mostly go cra-cra)
- Birds go "cip-cip"
- You say "ahia" when you hurt yourself
- Babies cry "ueeee"
- Sneeze: "etciu" (and you say "Salute!" which means "health")

Albanian:

- Cats go "mjau"
- Dogs go "hum"
- Sneeze: "atçu" (and you say "Shëndet", to which sneezing-person replies "U rritç!" Respectively "health" and "let you grow" or something along those lines)
- You say "auç" (pronounced like "ouch") when you walk into a table.
- I have to ask the parental units for more info on the rest

Edit for Fimbulvarg: I KNEW someone was going to say that XD
« Last Edit: October 29, 2014, 11:28:47 AM by Nimphy »
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Fimbulvarg

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Re: Onomatopeia and the like
« Reply #1 on: October 29, 2014, 11:11:12 AM »
But what does the fox say Nimphy?

...

Norwegian
Katter (cats) = Mjau (you may have been informed already)
Hunder (dogs) = Voff
Mus (Mice) = Pip
Fugler (birds) = depends on species, but they all tweet (kvitre)
Spurver (Sparrows) = pipip
Gjøk (cuckoo) = Koko
Ravn, kråke og sjur (raven, crows and magpies) = Kra
Ku (cow) = Mø
Sau (Sheep) = Bæ
Gris (pig) = nøff

Ouch= Au/Ao
Snore = snork
sound of Sneezing = Atsjo
« Last Edit: October 29, 2014, 11:31:39 AM by Fimbulvarg »

Fen Shen

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Re: Onomatopeia and the like
« Reply #2 on: October 29, 2014, 12:13:57 PM »
German
Katze (cat) = Miau
Hund (dog) = Wau /Wuff (depends on how aggressive it sounds, I'd say ;) )
Maus (mouse) = Piep
Vogel (bird) = Piep
Kuckuck (cuckoo) = Kuckuck (who would've guessed?)
Kuh (cow) = Muh
Schaf (sheep) = Mäh
Schwein (pig) = oink oink

Ouch= Aua
sound of sneezing = Hatschi (And the you respond "Gesundheit!" which means "Health!")
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Re: Onomatopeia and the like
« Reply #3 on: October 29, 2014, 03:37:02 PM »
Sparky Dragon the Ever Helpful has decided to demonstrate the onomatopeias in English.

- Cats go "meow" or "mew"
- Dogs go "bark" or "woof"
- Frogs and crows both say "croak," but frogs also say "ribbit" and crows also say "Caw"
- Birds go "tweet" or "cheep" or *Whistling noises*
- You say "Ow" or "Ouch" or "@#%!" when you hurt yourself
- Sheep say "Baa"
- Cows say "Moo"
- Babies cry "Waaa"
- A sneeze is "Achoo," and you say "Bless you."


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Re: Onomatopeia and the like
« Reply #4 on: October 30, 2014, 09:50:46 AM »
Finnish:
(I'm adding the verb in italics)
Kissa (cat) : miau / mau, kissa maukuu
Koira (dog) : hau, koira haukkuu
Sammakko (frog) : kurn, sammakko kurnuttaa
Lintu (bird) : titityy / tsirp tsirp, lintu visertää (it's different, I know)
Lehmä (cow) : muu / ammuu, lehmä ammuu
Lammas (sheep) : mää, lammas määkii
Sika (pig): röh röh, sika röhkii
Kukko (cock) : kukkokiekuu, kukko kiekuu
Hevonen (horse) : ihahaa, hevonen hirnuu


Vauva (baby) : yhyy / äääää
you, hurt : ai / aih / au / auts
Aivastus (sneeze) : ätsih

FrogEater

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Re: Onomatopeia and the like
« Reply #5 on: October 31, 2014, 07:22:54 AM »
Français :
 
Chat (cat) = Miaou
Chien (dog) = Ouah ! or (more recent) Arf !
Âne (donkey) = Hi-han!
Souris (mouse) = ?? Perhaps 'Iiiiiiii' (sounds Tuuri-like : Eeeeee !)
Oiseau (small bird) = Cuicui
Corbeau (crow) = Croa croa
Coq (rooster, cock) = Cocorico
Frog (grenouille) = Coa coa
Coucou (cuckoo) = Coucou (how unexpected...)
Vache (cow) = Meuh
Mouton (sheep) = Bêê
Cochon (pig) = Onk, onk (not standardised)

Ouch= Aïe ! or Ouille !
Sneezing = Atchoum (traditional response "à vos souhaits !", best wishes)
Snore = Rrrron....Pchhhhi...
« Last Edit: October 31, 2014, 12:29:22 PM by FrogEater »
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Luci

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Re: Onomatopeia and the like
« Reply #6 on: October 31, 2014, 11:42:43 AM »
Onomatopoeias are always funny~ Let me try something:

Portuguese:

Gato (cat) - Miau
Cachorro (dog) - Au Au
Pássaro (bird) - Piu Piu (but this varies depending on the species).
Macaco (monkey) - Something like "uh uh ha haa!"
Vaca (cow) - Muuu
Ovelha (sheep) - Béééé
Porco (pig) - Oinc Oinc
Sapo (frog) - Rebit
Grilo (cricket) - Cri Cri
Insetos voadores (flying intects) - zuuuuum
Galinha (chicken) - Po po po
Bebês (babies) - Buáááá
When you get hurt - Ai! or @&%#!
Espirro (sneeze) - Atchim! And you say "Saúde"(health).
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JoB

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Linguistics
« Reply #7 on: November 12, 2014, 06:48:48 AM »
I'm also not at all sure why German is German in English, either.
Because Germany was pretty late to form as a united country/territory and from all the Germanic tribes living in that area, the Germanen ("spear-wielding warriors") were closest to Britain and the Alemannen (literal meaning unclear) were closest to France. Hence, "Germany" and "Allemagne".

Similarly, "Saksa" and the like (Finland, Estonia, Old Icelandic) from the Saxons, "bawerski" (Lower Sorbic) from Bavarians, "Frángoi" (Middle Greek) = Franks, Teutons, Vagoth, ...

"Deutsch(land)" itself and the Italian "Tedesci" come from diutisc ("of the people"), a term tweaked over time to designate the group of all local Germanic dialects spoken across the territory.

The Slavic nations mostly use terms related to n?m?ci, a case of the recurring concept to call people who cannot express themselves in your language "mute". Possibly in the same vein, "miksisk?i" (Jatwingian, Old Prussian) = "to stammer".

[Edit for non-Unicode forum: "niemci" and "miksiskai".]

http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deutsch_in_anderen_Sprachen
« Last Edit: November 12, 2014, 06:52:40 AM by JoB »
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FrogEater

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Re: Etymology Thread
« Reply #8 on: November 12, 2014, 07:03:17 AM »
to JoB : very interesting, hoch interessant ! FYI, in French, we also have the adjective 'tudesque' (cf italian 'tedesco'), which is seldom used, as it is mainly litterary or tongue-in-cheek (but not abwertend, deprecative or insulting).

to Eich : thank you! Simple and effective solution! If you find the time for this, could you maintain in the first post a list of the codes and corresponding flags ?
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Re: Etymology Thread
« Reply #9 on: November 12, 2014, 10:55:23 AM »

The Slavic nations mostly use terms related to n?m?ci, a case of the recurring concept to call people who cannot express themselves in your language "mute". Possibly in the same vein, "miksisk?i" (Jatwingian, Old Prussian) = "to stammer".

[Edit for non-Unicode forum: "niemci" and "miksiskai".]

http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deutsch_in_anderen_Sprachen

I feel like I should apologize on behalf of the Slavic nations! Sorry, JoB (and other German-speaking/identifying folks)
But also I just wanted to see if my signature thingy worked.
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JoB

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Re: Etymology Thread
« Reply #10 on: November 12, 2014, 11:42:36 AM »
I feel like I should apologize on behalf of the Slavic nations! Sorry, JoB (and other German-speaking/identifying folks)
But also I just wanted to see if my signature thingy worked.
As I said, there are more examples of one populace applying its own term for "mute" onto another they don't have a common language with. And I'm not that easy to offend. (Ever heard of the "take the N-word back for ourselves" approach? I'm not comfortable telling those who feel offended by a racial slur "stop those feels and do that if you're smart", but I do happily call myself a Kraut. Even better, Powerkraut! :D )

Oh, and the changed sig appears on your old posts as well, give or take a couple reloads. :P
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Nuti

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Re: Etymology Thread
« Reply #11 on: November 12, 2014, 01:06:22 PM »
Just for fun, I throw there some observations about the (given) names of the Finnish main characters (and main support characters):

Tuuri and Onni are Finnish words that both mean "luck", and out of them Onni can also mean "happiness" (in sense of general well-being rather than outbursts of joy). Out of them, I've seen Onni being generally used as a given name, while I have never encountered a person named Tuuri (there apparently exist some, at least according to the name service site of Finnish population register center, but they are vanishingly rare). However, Tuuri sounds very similar to a common Finnish female name Tuuli, which also means "wind".

While being somewhat synonyms, words "tuuri" and "onni" can mean different things. "Tuuri" refers to coincidence-based luck, like winning in lottery or managing to get at bus stop just in time without looking at clock. "Onni" has boarder meanings, and it can be used in most occasions to replace "tuuri". However, "onni" also can mean general happiness and well-being, which "tuuri" never refers to. Also, "onni" is more formal and less slangish/dialectical word than "tuuri", in modern Finnish at least.

I think that the relationship of these words reflect something about the characters, too: Tuuri being more fidgetty and brash, Onni being more stable.


Lalli is also a real given name in Finnish (though not very common). Its etymology is fuzzy, but the name is best known as the name of possibly existing person in Finnish history. Namely, early Christian history. The pagan guy.

There exist several version of his story, but the main thread of most of them is this: Lalli was away from his home for some time, leaving his wife Kerttu in charge. A Swedish bishop, named Henrik/Henry, who was on his missionary travel / crusade in Finland, visits the house and eats and drinks there, and also feeds his horse. He pays for what he takes and leaves. But after Henrik leaves and when Lalli comes back, Kerttu claims that the bishop took food, drink and hay without paying them back. This enrages Lalli, and he storms after Henrik's sled, killing the bishop with his axe on the ice of Köyliönjärvi.

The stories often also mention that Lalli takes Henrik's mitre and signet ring, but once he puts them on, he can't remove them without tearing out his scalp and finger. Different stories feature also other kinds of details, usually making Lalli the bad guy and Henrik a martyr. (Which personally puzzles me, since you know, Lalli really though that Henrik didn't pay for what he took. Albeit, solving problems by raging with an axe isn't very constructive. Also, some stories imply that the mitre and the signet ring were something Lalli was originally after.)

The pagan influences of Lalli's legend pretty much fit to SSSS!Lalli's mage abilities, though personality-wise SSSS!Lalli appears really different from his legend namesake.

More about Legend!Lalli in Wikipedia.


Taru is a quite typical Finnish female name that means also legend, myth or an epic story (or a lie in most negative uses). I think it fits.
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Nimphy

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Re: Etymology Thread
« Reply #12 on: November 12, 2014, 01:08:07 PM »
Just for fun, I throw there some observations about the (given) names of the Finnish main characters (and main support characters):

Tuuri and Onni are Finnish words that both mean "luck", and out of them Onni can also mean "happiness" (in sense of general well-being rather than outbursts of joy). Out of them, I've seen Onni being generally used as a given name, while I have never encountered a person named Tuuri (there apparently exist some, at least according to the name service site of Finnish population register center, but they are vanishingly rare). However, Tuuri sounds very similar to a common Finnish female name Tuuli, which also means "wind".

While being somewhat synonyms, words "tuuri" and "onni" can mean different things. "Tuuri" refers to coincidence-based luck, like winning in lottery or managing to get at bus stop just in time without looking at clock. "Onni" has boarder meanings, and it can be used in most occasions to replace "tuuri". However, "onni" also can mean general happiness and well-being, which "tuuri" never refers to. Also, "onni" is more formal and less slangish/dialectical word than "tuuri", in modern Finnish at least.

I think that the relationship of these words reflect something about the characters, too: Tuuri being more fidgetty and brash, Onni being more stable.


Lalli is also a real given name in Finnish (though not very common). Its etymology is fuzzy, but the name is best known as the name of possibly existing person in Finnish history. Namely, early Christian history. The pagan guy.

There exist several version of his story, but the main thread of most of them is this: Lalli was away from his home for some time, leaving his wife Kerttu in charge. A Swedish bishop, named Henrik/Henry, who was on his missionary travel / crusade in Finland, visits the house and eats and drinks there, and also feeds his horse. He pays for what he takes and leaves. But after Henrik leaves and when Lalli comes back, Kerttu claims that the bishop took food, drink and hay without paying them back. This enrages Lalli, and he storms after Henrik's sled, killing the bishop with his axe on the ice of Köyliönjärvi.

The stories often also mention that Lalli takes Henrik's mitre and signet ring, but once he puts them on, he can't remove them without tearing out his scalp and finger. Different stories feature also other kinds of details, usually making Lalli the bad guy and Henrik a martyr. (Which personally puzzles me, since you know, Lalli really though that Henrik didn't pay for what he took. Albeit, solving problems by raging with an axe isn't very constructive. Also, some stories imply that the mitre and the signet ring were something Lalli was originally after.)

The pagan influences of Lalli's legend pretty much fit to SSSS!Lalli's mage abilities, though personality-wise SSSS!Lalli appears really different from his legend namesake.

More about Legend!Lalli in Wikipedia.


Taru is a quite typical Finnish female name that means also legend, myth or an epic story (or a lie in most negative uses). I think it fits.

Okay, while we appreciate the effort, Minna has already told us all of this AND it's not quite a translation. I'd appreciate it if this thread was simple to look through.  :-[
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Nuti

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Re: Etymology Thread
« Reply #13 on: November 12, 2014, 01:12:56 PM »
Oh dear! Sorry. Better consideration next time! *was boiling with explaining these all this day* But at least I got that out :'D Moving on~
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ThisCat

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Re: Etymology Thread
« Reply #14 on: November 12, 2014, 01:19:55 PM »
Okay, while we appreciate the effort, Minna has already told us all of this AND it's not quite a translation. I'd appreciate it if this thread was simple to look through.  :-[
Oh dear! Sorry. Better consideration next time! *was boiling with explaining these all this day* But at least I got that out :'D Moving on~

It's not really a problem though. It's good to have this somewhere for those who don't feel like running through all the comments, and it is sort of a translation, so it fits well enough. It's not like random comments about other people's translations are any better to fill the thread with (or worse).
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