Plus I think it is the only language that I have seen so far that uses a double ää umlaut.Well, Germans use the onomatopoie of "määh" for the sounds sheep make ...
Hei Kata Kissa! Hauska tutustua! Is that Lalli under the ferry table in your icon? Where did you get that?
I think määh would sound like a sheep. Don't see how it would be racist, though.Well, by implying that the language having more of those double-Ä's sounds like animals bleating ... ::)
If you were going to make inappropriate implications about Finns and livestock, wouldn't they involve reindeer rather than sheep? In fact I once found an old illustration... oh. Never mind.Then it'ld be a slur that fails to exist at all, as Germany has virtually no reindeer. (Matter of fact, I wouldn't have the slightest what sounds reindeer make, short of shaking silver bells while pulling Santa's sleigh ...)
I somehow had this in my bookmarks even though I never studied finnish, but I thought it might be useful for some of you!I was half expecting a list of ways to tell people things like "make way" or "not now, I'm in a hurry".
http://www.uusikielemme.fi/index.html (http://www.uusikielemme.fi/index.html) - Finnish for Busy People
Minä kuulen ääniä - I hear voices
... Useful to know.
There's a whole bunch more loanwords from russian than in finnish, but quite a lot of the vocabulary is almost like some thick eastern dialect of finnish, with some different grammar and sounds. There are also plenty words that are neither derived from finnish or russian. I can usually manage reading some sentences in an article but the intonation is so weird I mostly can't understand what's being said. Someone said it's like hearing Scots mixed with occasional Gaelic words would be to an English person, don't know of the validity of the claim.
Starfallz, that tumblr page is great! And new to me, yay and thank you! BTW I found your tumblr the other day, from a link on here I think? Maybe an art thread, and your drawings are fantastic and I'm stalking you now.
sooo my current finnish learning tactic is watching muumilaakson tarinoita (i.e. moomins)
it's a great way to get an ear for the language, and being a kids cartoon it's pretty easy to follow even w/o subtitles. plus it's the perfect excuse for watching cartoons in your pajamas and generally pretending to be a child on a saturday morning.
aaand it's a part of genuine, traditional finnish culture (achievement unlocked: sophistication) so what's not to like?
presently available at https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCm8yxjwVNlj65gfAAkLemzw
(warning: previous channel to host episodes of muumilaakson tarinoita had all episodes thereof deleted so they might not be here for long)
Cool idea!
OK! And for everyone, there's something I've been wanting to do, and I think it might be more fun as a group: read aRTD in the original language. Anyone want to try? We can do a page a day, something like that?
BTW Lalligaattori (cute name!)
and having written that, i think "the long road to comic comprehension" would serve as an excellent tagline.
on a different-but-actually-more-relevent-to-this-particular-thread note, i got the name from Eläinsanasto (https://nensarjakuvat.wordpress.com/elainsanasto/ (https://nensarjakuvat.wordpress.com/elainsanasto/)), which is a wonderful place for those who love both finnish and puns
think I'm going to have to put that in my sig, if you don't mind?
The link took me to a page that said what I'm searching for does not exist, but using their own search engine brought me to a page about singing and accompaniment courses which I guess is the right one. Underneath is a somewhat clumsy translation. I found nothing about the preferred age of participants or languages to be used in teaching in here or in the pdf brochure.
LAULUN MESTARIKURSSI
MASTER COURSE OF SINGING
LAULU
SINGING
Jorma Elorinne, Timo Honkonen, Sirkka Parviainen, Johanna Tuomi ja Sirkku Wahlroos
List of teacher's names
Welcome Peraphelion! I don't think I'd make it through a Finnish winter, either, but I think I'd like to try. Where are you now?
I don't think I'd make it through a Finnish winter
So I was listening to yle puhe when I picked my daughter up from school, and she got in the car and said, "what is that noise? It sounds like tears!"
Yes. Finnish sounds like tears. Exactly like them.
I even have a hard time understanding spoken English half the time, so I can't expect better in another language.
Pessi, attending a conservatory sounds pretty committed to me!
Daéa Reina, I'm always touched when someone wants to learn my obscure and mostly useless-to-anyone-who-doesn't-live-in-Finland mother tongue, so if you have any questions or other things I can help with concerning the language, just say.
Muumit on muuten kirjoitettu alkujaan ruotsiksi.
https://www.cs.tut.fi/~jkorpela/Finnish.html
Our eldest goddaughter used to watch it in Swedish as a small child and was then in raptures when she met Finland's Swedish children for the first time in her life, for they were speking the Moomin languge!
Sunflower, the Finnish hockey teams have all kinds of songs they've adopted as their "own". There are also lots of people who follow the US sports, so no wonder if our sports scene's musical taste is influenced by it.
1995 was in the hockey circles the year of great celebration for the realisation of a long held dream: our national team Leijonat (Lions) finaly beat Sweden's national team Tre kronor (Three Crowns) in a world championships final. That CD is part of the hype, so they've collected on it the most loved "team songs". (It has also such a glaring grammatical error on its cover that I don't know whether I should laugh or cry. Perhaps the best way to deal with it is just shrug and remember that grammar is not something the hockey scene is usually very interested in ;))
Auringonkukka, suomalaisilla lätkäjoukkueilla on kaikenlaisia "omiksi" otettuja lauluja. Täällä on myös paljon ihmisiä, jotka seuraavat jenkkiurheilua, joten ei liene ihme, jos meidän urheiluympyröidemme musiikkimaku on saanut vaikutteita sieltä.
Am I right that "Auringonkukka" is "Sunflower" in Finnish? Does it literally break down as "sun" + "flower," or is the "auringo-" part a cognate with other European languages' terms for "orange" or "gold"?
*hesitantly waves*
I just started learning Finnish last week, and I'm really excited, kind of intimidated, and kind of overwhelmed. But mostly excited.
Finnish is such a pretty language oh my word ^.^
I remember a couple occasions from youth, when visiting elderly people on various places in Finland, they actually switched to speak 'youthwise' or 'properly', when they saw me not getting them. This happened even with my own granny when she was (with me) visiting more distant family in the southeast coast. :-)
Ann Marie, se muumisarja jota oletan sinun katsovan, 90-luvun anime-versio Tanoshii Mumin Ikka, tuotettiin alkujaan japaniksi. Sitä on näytetty Suomen TV:ssä dubattuna sekä suomeksi että ruotsiksi. Vanhin kummityttömme katsoi sitä pienenä ruotsiksi ja oli sitten ihan haltioissaan tavatessaan ensimmäistä kertaa suomenruotsalaisia lapsia, koska he puhuivat muumien kieltä!
BTW, I'm amused to see that links to actual lessons are titled:
Starry-eyed study of Finnish (Intermediate Finnish 101)
Your honeymoon with the Finnish language (Intermediate Finnish 102)
The unbearable beauty of Finnish grammar (Intermediate Finnish 103)
If this post is redundant, I'll take it down.
And what's the big honking grammatical error? You've got me curious. :)
It is! And welcome! How is it going so far?Thanks! It's going pretty well, all things considered. I've been super busy, so I haven't had much time to spend on it. :/
I had a question about compound words... When I was looking at the basic learning Finnish stuff, it talked about how wonderful vowel harmony is. And when I am finally learning some Finnish words, and then many of the long words don't have that vowel harmony. Is that what happens with compound words?Yes, the vowel harmony only applies to the parts of the compound word, not the whole compound word.
I also think the Wikipedia article on Finnish orthography (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Finnish_orthography) is pretty good.
In Finnish, [ä & ö] are collectively referred to as the ääkköset when they need to be distinguished from the ISO basic Latin alphabet; the word is a somewhat playful modification of aakkoset, which is the Finnish for the alphabet as a whole.
punning level - Finnish
Commenter Brad Petry, an hour ago, offered a link to a six-fold Finnish ambiguity, curious as to its truth.
Help?
http://cdn.iwastesomuchtime.com/4262015024359.jpg
Bobriha, no sorry, I speak only german, english, french and a bit of spanish at the moment.Anton, my bad. Still, here is their list of texts in Simple Finnish: http://www.suomesta.ru/topic/finskij-yazyk/teksty-na-uproshhennom-finskom/ (http://www.suomesta.ru/topic/finskij-yazyk/teksty-na-uproshhennom-finskom/). Hope it will be useful.
I ran into a funny picture about the multile ways we Finns use the phrase "no niin" and thought I'd post it here:
(https://fbcdn-sphotos-f-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xta1/v/t1.0-9/s720x720/11107184_10152391035687706_2839687652494799388_n.jpg?oh=323b6b6e7d7be2dfd6db821c88c033e2&oe=55CC3F2D&__gda__=1438564156_dc108be8f1c694da529235e2f369700b)
Happy learning everyone ;)
http://cdn.iwastesomuchtime.com/4262015024359.jpg
Hi,
I've been lurking around in the forum but never posted before :) I'm native Finn, originally from Häme-region, currently living in Espoo (next to Helsinki).
I ran into a funny picture about the multile ways we Finns use the phrase "no niin" and thought I'd post it here:
(https://fbcdn-sphotos-f-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xta1/v/t1.0-9/s720x720/11107184_10152391035687706_2839687652494799388_n.jpg?oh=323b6b6e7d7be2dfd6db821c88c033e2&oe=55CC3F2D&__gda__=1438564156_dc108be8f1c694da529235e2f369700b)
Happy learning everyone ;)
It's interesting how Finns and Russians by saying their hearts moved in directly opposite directions express one and the same feeling :)
So whatever Finn does and wherever Finn (or at least parts of the Finn) goes, it is always upward :) . Kind of a good habit.
Speaking about this write down thing, in all dictionaries available to me including ungodly Google translator kirjoittaa muistiin goes first. Is there any difference between kirjoittaa muistiin and kirjoittaa ylös?
Olavi, thank you very much for explanation and in whole for this great amount of participation in us lazy learners!
And here goes another question that concerns me a lot. And I think I'll try it in Finnish.
Jos minä haluan kiittää jonkin kuin ylempänä (i.e., thank you for smth.) suomeksi , millainen sija on tarvis?
Hope the phrase doesn't sounds too odd...
Hello! I'm new here (I have recently received squirrel cookies) and am attempting to learn Finnish. Do any of you know where I can find information about Finnish cases? They're very confusing to me, and while I've found plenty on how to form them, an explanation on how to use them still escapes me. If anyone has links to share, they would be much appreciated!ll
Hi,
I've been lurking around in the forum but never posted before :) I'm native Finn, originally from Häme-region, currently living in Espoo (next to Helsinki).
I ran into a funny picture about the multile ways we Finns use the phrase "no niin" and thought I'd post it here:
(https://fbcdn-sphotos-f-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xta1/v/t1.0-9/s720x720/11107184_10152391035687706_2839687652494799388_n.jpg?oh=323b6b6e7d7be2dfd6db821c88c033e2&oe=55CC3F2D&__gda__=1438564156_dc108be8f1c694da529235e2f369700b)
Happy learning everyone ;)
Yritän kirjoittaa kirje.
Suomi on vaikea.
*itkee*
eta: Well, I managed one sentence, and wrote the rest in English. Hopefully didn't embarrass myself too badly.
Now, bed! zzzzzzzz
Well not too bad honestly. Really you only at least here missed the Imperfect form of "Yritän" which would be "Yritin", You should use the genetive form to signify that you were writing a letter so "Kirje" turns to "Kirjeen" and lastly "Vaikea" should be "Vaikeaa".
Really these are pritty minor mistakes that just get ironed out after hearing and using the language more so you shouldn't be troubled. :)
Well, when you are learning new language, stuff like making mistakes and forgetting words/grammar/everything just happens. Moreover, it happens all the time. It is nothing to loose your heart of.
Pyydän apua. Mitä ovat kuuleet merkitsee? En voi löytää kieliopista mitään samannäköistä :(. Ehkä olen tyhmä...
So for example: Ostan jonkin verran leipää / I'm buying some bread.
Here the base form Leipä transforms to Leipää because it is part of an action. I at least think that's how it goes.
It has inspired me with a new plan for studying Finnish. How to say,
"Honestly, I tried learning some Finnish, but I hurt myself. Do you speak English?"
Tytärnija hyväksyttiin laulukurssi.Did you mean "Tyttäreni hyväksyttiin laulukurssille"? You should check out how vowel harmony (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vowel_harmony#Finnish) and consonant gradation (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Consonant_gradation#Finnish) work in Finnish.
Did you mean "Tyttäreni hyväksyttiin laulukurssille"?
You should check out how vowel harmony (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vowel_harmony#Finnish) and consonant gradation (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Consonant_gradation#Finnish) work in Finnish.
The -ja/jä ending corresponds to the -er/or ending in English, in other words it makes a noun out of a verb (dance -> dancer/tanssia -> tanssija, visit -> visitor/käydä -> kävijä) so I don't know what you were trying to express with it.
Tarkoititko "Tyttäreni hyväksyttiin laulukurssille?" Sinun kannattaisi tarkistaa miten vokaalisointu (http://fi.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vokaalisointu#Suomen_kielen_vokaalisointu) ja astevaihtelu (http://fi.wikipedia.org/wiki/Astevaihtelu) toimivat suomessa.
-ja/jä loppu vastaa englannin -er/-or loppua, toisin sanoen se tekee substantiivista verbin (dance -> dancer/tanssia -> tanssija, visit -> visitor/käydä -> kävijä) joten en tiedä mitä yritit ilmaista sillä.
Hei Pessi! Mitä kuuluu? You haven't been here much lately.
Tytärnija hyväksyttiin laulukurssi.
I iz a MURICAN, and apparently its really hard to learn Finnish for Americans, but I really want to! A friend and I want to learn together. I need help on where to start.
If the Moomins is not yoor thing (I personally hate that anime version)
I have a link for you: http://www.suberic.net/~tahnan/finnish.html
I have a link for you: http://www.suberic.net/~tahnan/finnish.html
I don't think it's been posted here, but I could have missed it. It could also be somewhere else.
Suomi on eniten paras kieli!
That's the best pun I've seen on this forum and that's saying something. :D
What does it say? Is it possible to explain the pun in English?It means "Finnish is the most best language". xD
It means "Finnish is the most best language". xDNorwegian Sigrun using that wording all the time while the Finns just silently make it proper grammar for themselves sounds about right. :D
But I am not sure what the pun is.
voida = to can
pystyä = to be able to
ryagami, aloit siis opiskella suomen kieltä. Myönnän auliisti, että se on aika vaikeaa. Teit virheen kirjainten järjestyksen kanssa, mutta sellaista sattuu eikä se ole vakavaa.
ryagami, so you started studying Finnish. I freely admit it's quite difficult. You made a mistake with the order of the lettering, but that happens and it's not serious.
Tattia :o. En minä koskaan tavannut ne niin aikaisin enkä jopa uskonut ne voivat kasvaa toukokuussa.
I have a link for you: http://www.suberic.net/~tahnan/finnish.html
"Kieltä" onko partitiivissa? Joka tapauksessa on "vaikeaa"?
voida = to canIn English "can" and "be able to" have pretty much the same meaning, so I am still a bit confused. Do they mean the same in Finnish, too? Or are they used in different situations?
pystyä = to be able to
In English "can" and "be able to" have pretty much the same meaningUmmmh not that that's likely to apply here, but I have been taught the idiom of "do what you can and can what you can't" ...
voida = to can
pystyä = to be able to
I take it "voida" doesn't mean "can" in the sense of "preserve [fruit, tomatoes, etc.] in cans, jars, or bottles"? (I ask because I actually do know how to can and have the equipment for it, from years of living out in the country.)
In English "can" and "be able to" have pretty much the same meaning, so I am still a bit confused. Do they mean the same in Finnish, too? Or are they used in different situations?
Sorry... I get confused really easily...
They are pretty much the same in Finnish too. The only difference I see is that whether you "voit" to do something may depend on other people's permission, whether you "pystyt" to do something is up to your own resources. Isn't that the same in English? You may ask someone "can I take this book" but you wouldn't ask them "am I able to take this book" because that's something you yourself know best.
They are pretty much the same in Finnish too. The only difference I see is that whether you "voit" to do something may depend on other people's permission, whether you "pystyt" to do something is up to your own resources. Isn't thst the same in English? You may ask someone "can I take this book" but you wouldn't ask them "am I able to take this book" because that's something you self know best.It is true that for permission, can is more common than be able to, but I know of situations when people have used be able to when asking for permission to indicate their hesitation to ask about that permission.
And yes, "can" in sense of preserving things is indeed "tölkittää", literally to put in tölkki = a can.
The confusing thing is that "may" is also an auxiliary verb indicating a hypothetical present or future state. When David Byrne sings, "You may find yourself (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=98AJUj-qxHI) in another part of the world," he's not granting permission but speculating about the future.
Norwegian Sigrun using that wording all the time while the Finns just silently make it proper grammar for themselves sounds about right. :D
Ok, this construction: I/he/she/you/they/we should/have to do a thing. They are using Minun/sinun/hänen etc täytyy/pitaisi antaa coffee/beer/wine/whatever minulle/hänelle/sinulle etc. Except the object(I think? what is grammar) ending varies: kahvi, kahviä, or kahvin. Why?
Also, when asking "Could I have this?", is about "Voinko saada tämän?"
Pessi
"Voisinko" is likely formally correct, but I don't really see difference in meaning compared to "Voinko". Maybe just slight tone difference, with "voisinko" expressing more need for target of request. Could also be dialect issue.
A question to those who are knowledgeable about Finnish: How do you say please in Finnish? Is there a word for please in Finnish? (there is no word for please in Icelandic so I was wondering)
The context would be a sentence like: 'Can you please help me with this?' Or 'Please pass me that'.
There's no one word for please in Finnish, and the usual phrase "ole hyvä" (lit. transl. "be good") may even come across badly if used in normal speech since it may sound overtly polite/condescending. Finns use conditional instead to mark politeness in requests, so:
Can you help me with this? = Autatko minua tässä/voitko auttaa minua tässä?
Can you please help me with this? = Auttaisitko minua tässä? (conditional)
Pass me that. = Ojenna minulle tuo.
Please pass me that. = Ojentaisitko minulle tuon? (conditional)
Icelandic works with the same idea by the way ("Geturðu/gætirðu hjálpað mér... geturðu/gætirðu réttað mér..."), and similarly you can use both the polite and the less polite versions in daily speech, especially when talking to people you know. Politeness is not too hard in Finnish as long as you remember to avoid trying to be polite.
Uh, it made more sense when I was thinking of it than when I wrote it down...
Finns use conditional instead to mark politeness in requests
Politeness is not too hard in Finnish as long as you remember to avoid trying to be polite.
:finland: Voi myös sanoa "ole kiltti ja auta".
:uk: You can also say "be kind and help".
Of course "would you be so kind as to close the window" is already almost pure reproof ;)
The plural you (te) is the polite option, but it also sounds old-fashioned and is barely in use anymore.
kun puhut hyvin todennäköisestikorrektiaturmeltu yleiskieltä etkä puhekieltä.
you probably speakcorrectmangled standard language instead of colloquial language.
Ja jos Ann Marie ei ole siihen mennessä löytänyt kirjeellensä tarkistajaa voin tehdä senkin.
According to this site the song is a medieval Ingrian lament. It tells how the girl of Tuoni rows from shore to shore and comes to Meiälä, where she "pulls the linens across the doorways and the curtains over the windows and kills the master of the house". The original ending is longer, it mentions whinnying geldings and bellowing cows in addition to barking dogs and crying children.
Finnish question: How do you add case endings to words that end in s? Specifically in this case, how do I put vahvistus into accusative?
A random question from a random person - how similar are the Finnish and the Estonian languages? Can Estonians and Finns understand each other (at least somewhat) without learning the respective languages?
From what I've heard, many people in Estonia in the Soviet times used to listen to Finnish radio broadcasts, so I think they could understand Finnish a little bit.
Martti,
Disclaimer: I am not Finnish, nor do I speak Finnish, but from what I do know and a dictionary, I'm pretty sure you can translate "kakkiainen" as "poopy". I hope that helps?
Hum. So what does the "ka" in Hungarian mean?
Honestly not sure there's a more complete meaning in English.
Interesting no Finns have chimed in. Maybe poop is considered particularly vulgar there?
Ann Maries translation to English was spot on. Not much add to it. Word "poop" taught to children is "kakka" and then ad some cases (I'll leave that so somebody else, if needed) and you end up as description of a person (not so much a thing) which is poopy. Expression is difficult to use in mean manner. Could be used for small children in friendly way if they are dirty, with thing it self or otherwise.
For literally being soiled with poop (adjective), you would be "kakkainen".
-C
Actually the mythological creature kakkiainen didn't have anything to do with "kakka", poop. The name kakkiainen is synonymous with katkiainen. It's an obscure miniature creature that was believed to cut or break off ("katkoa"= to cut, to break off, "katki"= cut off, broken off, "katkiainen"=off-cutter, off-breaker) hairs, fishing lines and the strands of fishing nets. Other names for the creature are katka and katikas. The Finnish name for shrimp, katkarapu ("katka crab") is of the same origin as many kinds of tiny water creatures as well as beetles were believed to be katkiainen/kakkiainen.
Kakkiainen was also used as a name for small, harmless but annoying ghosts and delusions. Another name for these was hiiden lintu, "bird of hiisi". There were also some specific kakkiainen-creatures like kirkonkakkiainen ("church kakkiainen") that was a rather nasty haltija ("guardian spirit") of church buildings and unikakkiainen ("dream kakkiainen") that could show the place of hidden treasure to a sleeper.
There was also a belief that when fires were rising from graveyard it meant there were kakkiainens there (so kakkiainen had a connection to the will-o'-the-wisps) and that after a quarrel with a visitor there was a need for spells to ensure there won't be any kakkiainen making it's home in the house.
Edit
:finland: Tämä (http://languagecatalyst.com/wordpress2014/wp-content/uploads/2014/04/Finnish-comic.png) on yksi suosikkisarjakuvistani, kun suomen kielestä on kyse.
:uk: This (http://languagecatalyst.com/wordpress2014/wp-content/uploads/2014/04/Finnish-comic.png) is one of my favorite cartoons when talking about Finnish language.
Hei!
I was wondering if anyone knew of some kid's cartoons in Finnish with English subtitles? I think that that could be helpful for me, but I'm not sure how to find any. :-\
(also excuses to watch children's TV and feel like a little kid again woo!)
Hei!
I was wondering if anyone knew of some kid's cartoons in Finnish with English subtitles? I think that that could be helpful for me, but I'm not sure how to find any. :-\
I found this, but it seems super weird: xD
EDIT: Also, this: />
By the way, Finns have Moomin ballet :)
By the way, Finns have Moomin ballet :)
By the way, Finns have Moomin ballet :)
By the way, Finns have Moomin ballet :)
I know I'm going to fall asleep tonight pondering the uses of a word that means "not even from inside my dog".If you think of this particular dog (http://www.sssscomic.com/comic.php?page=340), I'm sure one can come up with some uses. The Finnish language thinks of everything. :D
I know I'm going to fall asleep tonight pondering the uses of a word that means "not even from inside my dog".
Ah, I didn't guess you were answering my question, sorry!
Jo tekin was supposed to mean I already did. Hm, jo olen tehnyt (I already have done) could be more appropriate...
I used this recipe http://www.kotikokki.net/reseptit/nayta/10880/Marjapiirakka/ There are actually hundreds of marjapiirakka recipes. For mine I used berries from our local species of strawberry https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fragaria_viridis. (I should admit, removing sepals from about 1 l of pea-sized berries was a real pain in all parts of body :) ) Anyway, I have got pretty decent cake finally. The only side note - you may probably want to powder your dough with some starch before filling it with berries. I didn't and it has come a bit wet.
Kermaviili .... Kervaviili
Kermaviili is is a type of sour cream, although its fat percent is usually at most 10%. It's viili (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Viili) made from cream as the name implies (kerma = cream).Kuuskytkolme, thanks for explanation!
I already did (it) = [minä] tein (sen) jo
Yes, my attempts to use Finnish are confusing, aren't they. XD
Such tiny strawberries! Cute! Um, but yes, I can see how they'd be hard to work with. The cake (I'm sorry but that is not pie, whatever they call it) looks delicious, though. The recipe you linked doesn't call for kermaviili...
I guess the name really is a straight loan from Swedish (as well as baking them is probably a Swedish cultural loan), because they are nonthless made of voitaikina ("butter dough") just like pasteija. Perhaps they should actually be called joulupasteija ("christmas pasty") ;)Tradition: beats logic since Stone Age! ;D
I really really like the way you paint whole pictures with just a few words.Well, I used to write some hokkus (in Russian, so there is no point to show them somewhere here).
Double post, hm... Anyway, here is my question:
Has päin honkia any literal translation? I understand that as a set phrase it may not necessary have one, but still?
As my dictionary says, honka is sort of a big old pine tree (so honkia would be plural partitive?) and päin depending on case of it's object may mean either from or towards. I don't know how it combines, if combines, with partitive, though.
Oulun polliisin velevottavat ohojeet Kuustokin juhulijoille
Oulusa pijetään taas 24. - 25.7.2015 melekoset vestivaalit. Väkiä tullee ympäri Suomia juhulimaa ja hauskaa pitämää. Me täälä Oulun polliisisa ollaan alvariinsa huolissaa juhulijoista ja siitä, että juhulien pittää sujua hyvi. Sen vuoksi päätettiin laittaa ohojeet, miten pittää käyttäytyä ja toimia, että vestivaalit sujjuu mahollisimman mukavasti. Suositellaa, että luvetta nuo kunnola läpi, niin muistatta. Toki joku hokara saattaa olla järkitonero, mutta hyvä jos suurin osa muistaa.
1. Elä mee rääsyisä alueelle, kannattaa vähän tälläytyä ja pöökätä ittiään. Valakkaa mukavat kostyymit niin viihyt paremmi.
2. Elä juo liikaa eläkä ahanehi pelekkää kalijaa tai muuta äkästä alakohoolia. Käy pian nii, ettet saa rahhoille vastinetta. Välillä pittää syyväkki jotaki, vaikka pannaania, kärkkäriä tai muuta vestivaalievästä. Ja välilä pittää juuva vettä tai vaikka limukkaa.
3. Jos meettä porukasa, pitäkääpä toisistanna huolta eläkääkä jättäkö kettää itekseen, etenkää jos se kaveri o kovastikki päissää. Pittää kehata mennä sanomaa järkkäreille tai ensiavun väelle, että tulukaa auttamaa kaveria.
4. Porise mukavia kaikkien kans. Ahastaha sielä on, monesaki välämäsä ja mussiikkisoun vallitesa, mutta se kuuluu vestareilla asiaa. Elä mee, jos ahistaa tai väenpaljous vaivaa.
5. Elä vie höpöjuttuja aluveelle, kuten puukkoja tai kepakoita tai muuta sellasta pölijää. Mitkään huumeet tai lääkkeetkää eivät kuulu vestareille.
6. Pijä huoli kamppeistas eläkä jätä niitä mihinkää. Joku ketku aina koittaa pölliä toisen ommaa, niistä pittää sanua henkilökunnalle heti, jos semmosta näkkyy.
7. Jätä huonotuulisuus kotia. Juhulisa ei änkyröijä eikä hölömöillä eikä missään nimesä aleta kähiseen. Ölövinä pittää osata olla eikä saa resuta. Kaikennäkösestä rähinöinnistä pittää heti alusa heretä pois.
8. Jos nää alat kovin ukisemmaan tai haastamaan riitaa, sitä voi käyvä nii, että polliisi tullee ja joutuu ojentammaan. Pahimmillaa nää pääjyt Ratakavun korttikaareen. Eikä auta, vaikka minkälainen herskapi ois. Nii kaua ku meitä ei tarvi, pilleet mennee hyvi.
9. Mikä se oli ensimmäine ohoje? Jos et muista, niin lujeppa uuvestaan ajatuksella läpi.
Tätä saa sitte iha vappaasti jakkaa veispookisa ja vitterisä ja instarammisa ja kaikisa mahollisisa metioisa!
Ystävällisin terveisin ja mukavia kekkereitä toivottaen, Oulun polliisi.
...and tanka by Japanese poet Ishikawa Takuboku:
Minä olen ihminen. Rinnassa hirveä nyyhkytys
kuuntelen, kuuntelen kulkua kahisevaa.
...
呼吸すれば、(kokyuu sureba,)Which may be translated like
胸の中にて鳴る音あり。(mune no naka nite naru oto ari)
凩よりもさびしきその音!(kogarashi yori mo sabishiki sono oto)
Well, it seems to me that grammatical differences between Oulu dialect and standard Finnish are systematic. And this "me ollaan" - as far as I know using passive as 1st person's plural form is usual in colloquial language?
kuuntelen, kuuntelen kulkua kahisevaa. - More gloomy then wind of autumn this sound!
Eli is more difficult, I can't straght out think of any other English counterpart than "so". I guess the latin word ergo is the nearest counterpart. "Cogito, ergo sum" = I think, so i exist.Would "therefore" also be a good translation, then?
Haaveet onnellisesta tulevaisuudesta sulhasen kanssa elivät vahvoina Harmajan mielessä.It conjugates like a verb.
Would "therefore" also be a good translation, then?
Thanks, Pessi!
This eli seems to be a verb, doesn't it? There is another sentence I've met it: It conjugates like a verb.
That's actually another word altogether, a conjugation of the verb elää (= to live). It looks deceivingly similar but is actually a completely different word than eli.
I thought I'd share with you a thing I found amusing: I just read a Child Health Center's recommendation that Finnish parents should read a lot to their small children, for otherwise the children won't learn the standard language since no one actually speaks it.
I wonder, how weird would look a person that tries to speak standard Finnish in daily life for average Finn?
I wonder, how weird would look a person that tries to speak standard Finnish in daily life for average Finn?
Hei Oxi ja Bobriha! This is a bit late answer, but you can say either "Hei kaikille" (Hi to everyone), or "Hei kaikki" (Hi, everyone). :)Hei Letizia ja kiitos!
:finland: Bobriha, olet kirjoittanut todella viehättäviä runoja! Nostan hattua, en varmaankaan itse saisi aikaiseksi kirjoittaa runoa millään vieraalla kielellä. Olen itse aika uusi tällä foorumilla, ja on hienoa huomata miten paljon täällä on eri kielistä kiinnostuneita ihmisiä. Tekisi mieli aloittaa itsekin jonkin uuden kielen opiskelu.
:uk: You've written very nice poems! Kudos to you, I don't think I'd manage to write a poem in any of the foreign languages I know. I'm rather new to this forum, and it's great to see so many people who are interested in different languages here. I want to start learning some new language myself...
Ah, sorry to tell you this but you don't actually need partitive for the sentence "en ole suomalainen". In plural, however it would be in partitive: "emme ole suomalaisia". That is quite confusing now that I think about it!B-but doesn't negative statement require partitive?
B-but doesn't negative statement require partitive?Googlettelin tätä ikuisuuden ja sain selville, että kyseessä on predikatiivilause, eikä predikatiivi ole partitiivissa edes kieltolauseessa. Asia on selitetty esim. täällä: http://thefinnishteacher.weebly.com/lausetyypit--the-types-of-clause.html
Googlettelin tätä ikuisuuden ja sain selville, että kyseessä on predikatiivilause, eikä predikatiivi ole partitiivissa edes kieltolauseessa. Asia on selitetty esim. täällä: http://thefinnishteacher.weebly.com/lausetyypit--the-types-of-clause.html
I spent ages googling this and found out that the statement in question is a predicative clause, and the predicative is never in the partitive form even when the sentence is negative. It's explained e.g. here: http://thefinnishteacher.weebly.com/lausetyypit--the-types-of-clause.html
Wow, thank you for your effort! And the site itself looks very useful.
En minä koskaan teen sitä erehdystä taas! Sen sijasta ajon tehdä tuhannet muita erehdyksiä ;D
Haluaisin osata venäjää paremmin, olen opiskellut pari alkeiskurssia mutta siitäkin on jo aikaa ja olen tainnut unohtaa suuren osan. Sitten on monia muitakin kieliä joita olisi hauska opiskella, jos olisi määrättömästi aikaa!Minä olen venäläinen. Ja minä haluaisin puhua/kirjoitaa enemmän suomeksi, koska unohdan sitä ilman harjoituksia. Lukemista vain ei ole riitoisaa.
I'd like to know Russian better, I took a couple of elementary courses but it's been a long time and I've forgotten a lot of what I knew. And then there are other languages I'd be interested to learn, if only I had enough time for everything. :>
So, if to present it as a table
Positive Negative
Suomalainen (count-word) Minä olen suomalainen (nom.) Minä en ole suomalainen (nom)
but:
Minulla on ystävä suomalainen. Minulla ei ole ystävää suomalaista
Kirjakaupassa on suomalainen. Kirjakaupassa ei ole suomalaista
Vesi (non-count word) Tämä on vettä (part.) Tämä ei ole vettä (part.)
and so on
would this look correct?
Spoiler: show
as a reader and a hobbyist writer I don't think it should be "one convention or the other"
Also, word-level ambiguity in poetry and fiction is something I often find fascinating (e.g. I read sillä = arolla, but you might have read it differently), and I personally liked some of those original expressions a lot.
Tästä tulee mulle mieleen yksi paikka: kun olin lapsi niin meillä oli rannassa saunamökki ja sen nurkalla kasvoi valkovuokkoja. Keväisin seurattiin, kun ne nousivat mullasta ja sammalesta ensin kumarina ja vähitellen avasivat kukkansa. Valkovuokot eivät olleet kovin yleisiä siellä, joten niissä oli jotakin erityistä, vähän jännittikin että ovatko ne selvinneet talven yli. Ne menestyivät kuitenkin hyvin ja levisivätkin niin, että niitä oli joinakin vuosina suuri matto kuusen alla.
(e.g. I read sillä = arolla, but you might have read it differently)Yup, this is what it meant to be. But siellä seams to be better. Or maybe nothing at all.
What you say about reversing word orders makes me ponder. Traditional Finnish poetry bends word orders very heavily, but that is usually done in order to achieve a rigorous rhythm-and-rhyme formula. I have read somewhere that in the Russian-language culture, the older and stricter rules of poetry were loosened by respected poets at some point and the results were deemed fruitful (and this had a huge impact on smaller Soviet literary cultures of that time, too). Meanwhile in Finland (mainly during the 1950s and the 1960s, I think), there was a bitter confrontation between the old school and the new school. Most younger poets completely abandoned rhyme and pretty much gave up old rhythm rules as well. This is why I might not have enough tradition to lean on: in my world, it has been so much more of an "either-or".
As far as Bobriha herself allows it, the web age enables all of us to share different versions of her works, and hopefully every correction suggestion gives some more insight into how the Finnish language works.
I think it is marvelous how near professional level Bobriha gets as a Finnish poet, even without any help, before having completely mastered some nomen declensions.
Although.....although I wasn't sure if the links would work, so I went to see a preview and clicked 'post' instead. XD
Hey! This website has been pretty good for a beginner, like me:
http://www.digitaldialects.com/Finnish.htm (http://www.digitaldialects.com/Finnish.htm)
Also, I skimmed through this pronunciation giude first and it was actually pretty good.
https://www.cs.tut.fi/~jkorpela/finnish.pronunciation.html (https://www.cs.tut.fi/~jkorpela/finnish.pronunciation.html)
Although
Hey, that first site was actually the one I started with! :)
Sorry for the thread-necro! :-[
I've wanted to learn Finnish for a while (oddly enough, it began when I started reading SSSS ;)) and I finally have a bit of time in my schedule to do it. (not that I didn't have time before, but I was being lazy) I was wondering if anyone has any pointers for a beginner?
Ja kuitenkin, sikäli kuin olen jo tullut tähän, niin haluasin näyttää tätä kesärunoa, jonka kirjoitin jo maaliskuuna. Nopea Bobriha on nopea.
Se laulaa.
Taivaan, näkymättömiä kiuruja täynnä,
alla,
yli aron, häilyvien höyhenheinien,
joilla hitaat pilvien varjot vaeltavat,
muinaisella kivellä
se istuu, suu avoin,
ja tuuli lentää läpitsensä.
Kun polkupyörästä nouset
levähtääksesi –
on suuri maalilma, ja katsot nyt korkeukselta –
kun vesipullon kansin kierrät auki,
se laulaa.
Ja kuitenkin, sikäli kuin olen jo tullut tähän, niin haluasin näyttää tätä kesärunoa, jonka kirjoitin jo maaliskuuna. Nopea Bobriha on nopea.
Se laulaa.
Taivaan, näkymättömiä kiuruja täynnä,
alla,
yli aron, häilyvien höyhenheinien,
joilla hitaat pilvien varjot vaeltavat,
muinaisella kivellä
se istuu, suu avoin,
ja tuuli lentää läpitsensä.
Kun polkupyörästä nouset
levähtääksesi –
on suuri maalilma, ja katsot nyt korkeukselta –
kun vesipullon kansin kierrät auki,
se laulaa.
Tuuli=wind
One word! I know one word out of all that! I'm so learned! T.T
Ah well I'll figure it out eventually.
Odd question: What are the words/"names" of the different fingers? Especially if they have particularly amusing literal meanings.
anyone have any other good online sites to learn on?
Okay, guys, I probably need your help (if you know the Finnish grammar and all like that).
I have a Finnish textbook, teaching is divided into lessons and each lesson has several tasks to perform. I carry out these tasks and I try to do them correctly, but I have no one\anything who can find and point out my mistakes (and explain them). So if someone can help me with checking my tasks - I will be very grateful!
I can try to help, I'm a native Finnish speaker. :)Oh, it will be very, very cool!
Oh, it will be very, very cool!
I can scan the pages of my textbook with tasks and my notebook with the completed tasks, if it's convenient for you.
Mild thread necromancy for this, but I figured I might ask.
I've been trying to learn Finnish for quite a while now, and I do all right with vocabulary, but I can't find a way to study grammar that motivates me well. I've found that flash card websites, especially ones with streak counters, do work well for me, but I can't seem to find any good ones that deal with grammar. Does anyone know of anything like this? Really, anything that can be done a few minutes at a time and has a daily streak counter would work.Spoiler: it works really well show
Thank you in advance!
I don't know anywhere to learn grammar, but what's that site you're using for vocabulary? I'd kinda like to try it.
It's called Memrise! Pretty standard as far as flash-card-based review websites go, but it does have a couple of nice added features (the daily streak counter being my favorite) and a boatload of preset courses you can choose from (here (https://www.memrise.com/courses/english/)). You can also make your own sets, of course.
It's a good web site, I like it :) There's just nothing very good there for Finnish grammar.
Do you mean like school books meant for adults learning Finnish, or children’s books?
Somewhere I saw Eila ja Ossi recommended, I gather it's intended for immigrants to Finland. I managed to find a pdf online, but then got swamped with work (and my trip to Finland cancelled :( ) so didn't get far. But I'm planning to get back to it once I finish renovating my home office. What website are you using?
I can take a look...thanks!Yeah, I’m using Duolingo as well and I like how it works for me. But of course the best way to learn any language is to take regular lessons from that language-speaking person, I think.
I’m using Duolingo at the moment–great for speaking, not so much for grammar.
Here is a collection page of teaching videos by YLE, the Finnish public broadcaster: https://yle.fi/aihe/oppiminen/suomen-kielen-alkeet
I have no idea how good (or not) these are in terms of being interesting / engaging, but the language will likely be correct.
Oh, I gotta keep this thread in mind, I´m also still looking for something better than Quizlet to learn! (Don´t learn Finnish from scratch with Quizlet. At least not with Quizlets other people made. They keep having spelling mistakes.)
When I googled the book Vulpes mentioned, one of the first things that came up was a website dedicated to book recommendations for learning Finnish. I´m not sure how helpful it is, and whether you already found it, but I´ll drop it here anyway:
https://finland.fi/life-society/how-the-heck-do-you-learn-finnish-part-1/
I’m using Duolingo at the moment–great for speaking, not so much for grammar.
Duolingo finally added Finnish????Yes! They actually did! I was so excited when I found that out!
Duolingo finally added Finnish???? Maybe it's time to revisit my attempts to learn... I do well with the "gamification" style of learning, after all...
And now that we began learning Finnish, check this out so you don´t get too stuck with stuff you don´t really need: ...
Oh no, the third one will be stuck in my head for all eternity. :'D
So in the second one Ismo starts it with saying that it's an incorrect rumor that Finns can't do small talk - our small talk is just a more developed/advanced version. It happens when two or three men who don't know each other are in the sauna together:
For the second one, the subtitles don´t seem to work. Youtube thinks it is Spanish for some reason. I highly doubt he´s talking about gods with asthma...
Ismo isn't curious enough to ask his wife about 2-3 women small talking in the sauna I guess... :D
If you guys want comments from a native speaker on your videos from time to time, you can PM me. I’m not a teacher or anything, but I can comment in English or Finnish if you think it’d be helpful.
Oh and I got Mauri Kunnas' dog-version for my sister's kids.... wait, what (http://www.minnasundberg.fi/comic/page215.php)? O_O
... wait, what (http://www.minnasundberg.fi/comic/page215.php)? O_O
I'm new to learning Finnish - I've been noodling around with it for about a year. I do at least one Duolingo lesson a day, as well as go through some flash cards. I've been reading Harry Potter and the Sorcerer's Stone in Finnish (with an English copy nearby because I frequently get stuck). I have also started reading the Hobbit in Finnish because, wow is it beautiful and I've read the book more times than I can count. I am constantly looking words up and am definitely in the elementary levels but am having tons of fun! My ultimate goal is to read the gorgeous 1935 copy of the Kalevala (in Finnish) that I found in my favorite used book store. Last year, when I started teaching myself Finnish, I stumbled across SSSS.
I've had trouble finding places where people talk about learning Finnish, so it's great to find this community.
Hope everyone is doing well!